I'm somewhat perplexed by the wide girth given to Socit Verney-Carron frres for being whole. I will acknowledge that at the turn of the 20th century V-C was looking for corrosion resistant tube steel and provided input to some steel concern and I assume that to be Joseph Holtzer. But it was seem that their post WWII or post 1960s ability has attached a bias to their pre-WWII status. V-C wanted to turn out world renown wares and I would be hesitant to say that they did not procure the best of the best effort for their tubesets. So if V-C is not receiving prizes for their tube efforts, would they not want to source a tube maker who has received such accolades? The tubes are at the nucleus or core for the sporting weapon platform. At the turn of the century it appears that Socit Verney-Carron frres - St. Etienne was real chummy with Zavattero freres(Louis & Joanny) and they filed for at least one joint patent. Just from these type side ventures one would tend to believe that V-C was either sourcing, cross-sourcing or being sourced. For the moment I am not sure of the relationship but it would seem that Zavattero freres facility was a possibility( usine Saint Bonnet le Chteau).

"Verney jeune" in Lyon advertised as Verney - Carron or Verney Carron et Compagnie, correct? So could it be that Verney-Carron et Cie Lyon has it origins from the 1620s and Socit Verney-Carron frres has its origins from 1820? Verney-Carron et Cie Lyon did indeed sourced Liege like craftsmen like Lebeau and others I'm sure. And for a second I would begin to think that Verney-Carron et Cie Lyon was the concern that registered with the Liege proofhouse, but that possibility quickly disappears and I am back to Socit Verney-Carron frres as surely there was some close working relationship between Socit Verney-Carron frres & Verney-Carron et Cie Lyon as the two concerns essentially have the same name. Confusion is even evident today, and what about trademark issues and other related? It would seem that Socit Verney-Carron frres embraces the confusion as they can pen their history as they see fit. Then Paul's example has the term VECAR which was a trademark of Socit Verney-Carron frres and used on their letterhead. 1960s adverts tend to suggest that both Socit Verney-Carron frres & Verney-Carron et Cie Lyon were under the same umbrella.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse