March
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
Who's Online Now
6 members (Argo44, Little Creek, SKB, DaveB, gunmaker, 1 invisible), 788 guests, and 4 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums10
Topics38,374
Posts544,010
Members14,391
Most Online1,131
Jan 21st, 2024
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
Sidelock
OP Offline
Sidelock

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
My Merkel 16 bore O/U shotgun was proofed in 1933 and has 65 mm chambers and is in excellent condition. Question what would be the maximum service pressure for shot shells that I would load/fire in this Merkel? I have not seen or missed German shot shell max service pressures listed based on gauge and chamber length.

Is this information accurate? "From Larry Brown's recent communication with the Birmingham Proof House, I thought an addendum should be placed at the end of this thread in case anyone is saving it for future reference:

**650 bars is standard CIP (British and European) service pressure for shells designed for guns proofed at the CIP standard of 850 bars**

European (CIP) proof pressure of 850 kg per sq. cm. (BAR) = 13,920 psi proof pressure= 10,730 psi service pressure (SAAMI)

Per the 1954 Rules of Proof, here are the equivalent service pressure values:
3 tons--8,938 psi
3 1/4 tons--9,682 psi
3 1/2 tons--10,427 psi
4 tons--11,917 psi
These numbers SHOULD apply to guns proved under the 1925 rules, which were stamped only with chamber length and shot charge. Thus, a 2 1/2" chambered gun, 1925 rules of proof, would be equivalent to 3 tons; a 2 3/4" chambered gun to 3 1/4 tons.

A service pressure of 3 tons per sq. in. = 8,938 psi service pressure (SAAMI)"

Thanks!
Jim

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,736
Likes: 181
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,736
Likes: 181
I for one would not mix British & German data unless you know you are comparing apples to apples. Per Wirnsberger, the chamber of a German double under the 1912 rules pushing OVER 55.5 grains, 1 1/4 oz, of shot for a 12 bore with 70mm chambers or OVER a 1 oz payload in a 16 bore should not be chambered unless the scattergun has experienced special proof which is in excess of 75% over the service load.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
The 1989 version of Wiederladen, shows in the table for shotgun ammunition, that the maximum allowable gas pressure for 16 ga shells( this is service load, not proof, pressure) is 680 bar. Current rules may use different units of measure.
Mike

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,736
Likes: 181
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,736
Likes: 181
Good info there Ford. I am curious to what psi value this 680 bar actually transforms?

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 544
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 544
Raimey, IF the internet converter is to be believed, 680 bar converts to 9,860 psi.


NRA Benefactor 2008
NRA Patron 2007
NRA Endowment 1996
NRA Life 1988
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,091
Likes: 192
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,091
Likes: 192
Remington 16 gauge Game Loads, 2 1/2 drams equivalent, 1 ounce, #6 or #8, five bucks a box on sale. Won't blow up any gun and won't send you to the poorhouse.

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
Sidelock
OP Offline
Sidelock

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
Mike,
Does it list the maximum allowable service pressure for 65 mm 16 ga. shells?
Thanks for the previous information!
Jim

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Jim,
As far as I can tell, the max is the same for 65 and 70mm.
Mike

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
Sidelock
OP Offline
Sidelock

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
Mike,
Thanks for the information!
Jim

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Jim,
You are welcome.
Mike


Link Copied to Clipboard

doublegunshop.com home | Welcome | Sponsors & Advertisers | DoubleGun Rack | Doublegun Book Rack

Order or request info | Other Useful Information

Updated every minute of everyday!


Copyright (c) 1993 - 2024 doublegunshop.com. All rights reserved. doublegunshop.com - Bloomfield, NY 14469. USA These materials are provided by doublegunshop.com as a service to its customers and may be used for informational purposes only. doublegunshop.com assumes no responsibility for errors or omissions in these materials. THESE MATERIALS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANT-ABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT. doublegunshop.com further does not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials. doublegunshop.com shall not be liable for any special, indirect, incidental, or consequential damages, including without limitation, lost revenues or lost profits, which may result from the use of these materials. doublegunshop.com may make changes to these materials, or to the products described therein, at any time without notice. doublegunshop.com makes no commitment to update the information contained herein. This is a public un-moderated forum participate at your own risk.

Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without prior written consent of the Copyright holder. For specifics on Copyright Law and restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.0.33-0+deb9u11+hw1 Page Time: 0.083s Queries: 36 (0.062s) Memory: 0.8397 MB (Peak: 1.8990 MB) Data Comp: Off Server Time: 2024-03-28 23:55:37 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS