doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Faux Damascus---Who Used It?

Keith,

I personally have never seen Faux Damascus on a major name American sxs. That is not say it was not done. I have learned enough to never say never.

I have seen the link that Joe posted many times before. It contains some interesting information.

1.) It is the most complete primary source that by 1895 Belgium was producing mechanized Damascus. This was happening in the rolling mills. Greener alludes to it. Ernst Heuse-Lemoine mentions it in his "Manufacture of Damascus Gun Barrels" published about the same date. The British proof house tests of 1888 also refer to mechanized Damascus.

This also coincides with the Joris patent. Joris was a Belgian maker who in 1894 filed a patent in Great Britian for the mechanical production of damascus bar stock. While in Belgium at about this time, Florent Heuse-Bovy filed a patent for a machine that would produce damascus barrels.

2.) The report inaccurately speaks about proof loads that are 100% or double the service load. In fact, the King of Belgium interceded in 1895 to increase the proof load to 80% more that the service load.

3.) The report suggests that all the terrible Faux Damascus was coming from countries other than Belgium. This is more marketing hype. By 1895 Damascus production was winding down in England and else where. It was reaching it's zenith in Belgium.

4.) Like all the British write ups. They decry all foreign iron and steel as being inferior to their domestic material. While in fact, they were importing steel from Sweden at about this time.

Pete

A British gun I recently bought of obscure make but reasonable quality and condition was sold to me as having fake damascus tubes ("because of the way it's worn bright near the breech"); I said nothing in response to such bs. The tubes are clearly pattern welded, but I think the dealer was trying to convince me it was a good buy. Plenty have yet to cotton on to the fact that damascus is increasingly desirable in the market, so plenty of guns are probably being sold as "fake" damascus by people not really up with learned opinion about the beauty and safety of damascus tubes.
RG

When Damascus is worn shiney the pattern most likely won't show at all...and when it's blued the pattern is real hard to detect except in strong light.

When it comes to vintage guns I would think there are more fake steel barreled guns than fakeed Damascus barreled guns...(by fake I mean later-life blued over Damascus barrels).

This is actually a modern flintlock with Faux Damascus


An late Ottoman miquelet with Faux Damascus


Another Ottoman miquelet with damascene, engraving, again Faux Damascus.


Yes some have "blackened" or blued Damascus to hide it. Originally it was normal to find "black & white", blackened, "brown & white" or browned. Puraye talks about all 4 methods. It was also possible to see barrels that had been etched in hydrochloric acid. A finish sometimes preferred on German guns.

You can see original samples of these finishes here:
http://damascus-barrels.com/Finish_Restore.html

Damascus barrels straight off the forge will not show any pattern. I have some here waiting to be ground. The barrels have to be ground then struck. This removes the surface material from the hammer forging and exposes the layers of the billets. This was done during the grinding. The striking enhances the pattern. I believe Dr Gaddy used to recommend 300 or 350 grit before the etch.

More great info, much appreciated. I've only really come to appreciate Damascus in the past couple years and have a lot to learn. I agree with Cadet's assertion that the fake Damascus label is applied in order to sell guns, but the market is evolving and I don't see as many at give-away prices as before. I could kick myself over several I passed on. One was an A grade Harrington and Richardson. I never dreamed H&R made a gun like that, and I've never seen another. It was interesting, but maybe not the best as an investment... I don't see many wanted to buy ads for H&R doubles. And jOe is right about reblued Damascus being hard to detect. I learned the hard way on a grade 2 L.C. Smith that was very hard to see, even in bright sunlight. Bought at a poorly lit gun show, and represented as fluid steel. Called that one Damn-mascus.