doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Was Parker the 1st to use Whitworth Steel Bbls.?

Mike McIntosh asked me this question.(I think he knows the answer!!) I have seen Lefever Optimus, Parker AA &A1 Spl's. Are there "Others"? CC.

L C Smiths

Xchisles, I have seen Baker L Grade and De Luxe with Whitworth barrels. Also Syracuse Arms D Grade, Smith A2 and higher, Lefever Optimus. All of these were made after the turn of the century. I have an 1887 Lefever catalog [my date mark] offering Kilby or Whitworth for the Optimus. An 1889 Catalog has the same offering. If my memory is correct, Parker offered Whitworth beginning sometime in the mid 1890s.

The Linnerman Lefever Optimus shown in the Double gun Journal has Whitworth barrels. It is Circa 1887.
Chris

I assume you mean the first American firm?

Chris, What's the SN on the Linnerman Lefever Optimus?

GregSY,Was inhaling smoke-lamp fumes from inletting action-s
trap,before breakfast....Should have put"In the United States"
Daryl H.Thanks also for Imfo. I wonder what the earliest date that an American Maker used 'Whitworth Tubes'?The earliest Parker that I have had was No108226 c.1901. CC/dt

You can buy this one from 1894 ...it's a nice 'un.

http://www.ivorybeads.com/site/default.a...&FSID3=2301

David, there is an interesting story on the LC Smith Whitworth barrels. Whitworth was LC's biggest supplier and LC was Whitworth's biggest client. Whitworth decided to raise their prices and put pressure on LC beforehand. They slowed deliveries until there was a fair backlog. They chose this moment to inform LC of a price increase. LC waisted no time finding a knight in shining armour. Krupp supplied them with the immediate needs for less money and reputedly, with a better product. Out of the goodness of their colonial hearts, LC informed Whitworth of this and that they would continue to buy Whitworth barrels only at a price REDUCTION, not an increase. Whitworth was unhappy but relented. Krupp was bummed but became an optional source. The Yanks were quite pleased with themselves.

It is my firm and informed belief that Whitworth fluid steel barrels were first used by a Manchester (U.K.) gunmaker.I have the details somewhere.

David, the Winter 2007 issue of DGJ carries an article on Jim Hall's Parker AAH that, as I remember, was the first Parker to sport Whitworth barrels. I can't locate my copy however, so I don't know the serial number.

Dean

Almost 36K for cut barrels! That why it's been there for a while.

W.& C. Scott Gunmakers used Sir Joseph Whitworth's Fluid Compressed Steel Barrels, starting in 1882

Sal......Theres a turn in the history books! Would be most interested in your further Info'I was asked a question here, Did any of the London Gunmakers run there machine-shops with Steam-Power?Thought this question might be "Up your Alley"? Pictures would be "Grand"(So much to learn, So little time.) cc/dt

The first I see L C Smith offering Whitworth in ads or catalogs is 1894.

cc/dt
Certainly we Blackcountry artisans used water power in the gunmaking industry, barrel forging etc.,in fact there is an Industrial Estate at Halesowen that was built around a river to power the machinery and many outworkers set up around that brook including Brett Parsons Leatherwork, Brady's, Clive Lemon et.al.
I don't know about 'The Smoke' guntraders as my Bonneville,Bullet, and Rocket only ever made it to the Ace Cafe at Watford.Any way your older than me.Ha Ha.

Can you imagine some jamoke taking a hacksaw to a set of Whitworth tubes on an AAHE Parker?

Waterpower as source of industrial power for weapon factories was well developed by at latest, mid 1600s, even in remote Sweden. Don't know when steam was displacing water power. Interior layout of factories did not change much because of transition to steam. Both power sources were external to workshop buildings.

What steam did allow was more flexibility in locating major weapons factories. No longer needed to find nice river or build dam to have power. Steam also allowed, at least in principle, factories to operate independent of rivers icing up, of droughts, of flood damage.

Niklas

I found a couple pages loose from a DGJ...on one was an article by david truesdale entitled "Why Parker"...seems he is a Lefever fan & was correcting facts in an earlier parker[spring 2002] piece.
he says lefever had first whitworth tubes in1889 ..parker in1894
if that helps any
cheers fanc