doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 1st post introduction- purchase advice

Hi. I'm new to the forum and this is my first post. Been lurking on and off for years. I'm a hunter, clays shooter and a double gun fan but especially have a passion for SxSs. I have a Ugartechea grade 1 12 and an old Stevens 311 16 that I refinished. I also have a SKB 505 O/U for sporting clays.

I'm finally in a position to purchase an upgrade to my Ugartechea. I am looking for new and I am working with ABOUT an $8,000.00 budget. (maybe slightly more) I am still deciding if I want a 12 or a 20. The gun will be used for upland and some occassional sporting clays. It must have an english straight stock and double triggers. I have always been a fan of the looks of a side lock. (excuse me if I don't use the proper terms as I refresh my memory) I've not been on the forum for sometime so I have lost touch with the various available makers that might fit my needs. Any advice, direction and input will be greatly appreciated! Thank you for the time.

Dave

A pretty good 12b Brit Sle can be had for around 8K.
Find the right dealer, and ask the right questions.
The good ol'beans here are a great help!
Get a tweed cap in the meantime - it'll help when talking to those twit dealers.

I was in the same boat about a year ago. I now have generally gone the Parker reproduction route (20ga and 28ga), but I do have one sidelock a Grulla 216RL. It is a 6 3/4 pound 12 ga with 28" barrels (IC/M).

If I had to keep just one gun that would be the one without a doubt. Great quality and an absolute joy to shoot, it makes the ideal upland game gun and an all around shooter for any kind of clays. I found one in like new condition for $6000, but they generally run around $7,000 to $7,500.

Check out the book "Spanish Best" by Terry Weiland.

Don't make the same mistake many do -stay away from a 12, Buy a 20.

With a budget like that, you may want to consider getting a 12 and a 20. At roughly $4k each you can get a very nice pair.... One for sporting clays and one for the field. Most targer shotguns are too heavy to carry in the field for extended periods of time and most field guns will beat the crap out of you if you shoot them three or four hundred rounds a day.

Just a thought, I never said it was a good thought

Thanks for ALL the input. I'll definitely be looking into these options. I'd prefer to just stay with one gun for all my needs. I already use my Uggie quite often for clays without too much difficulty with recoil but I apreciate the advice.

I've always been fond of Merkels. Can't give an explanation as to why. However I've not really looked into them much so I don't know much about them. I've got a dealer close that I'll be stopping into. I have looked on-line at the Grulla and will give it a long second look.

Dave, You began by saying your torn between a 12 and a 20 gauge.
Why not consider the best handling and patterning gauge on the planet. 16 GAUGE !!!!!

For 8k there are some real strong original DHE 16 Parkers out there. I am a doubles nut but if you like the Merkels I gotta tell you that Schwandt Arms has a stunning 16 bore Prussian Daly O/U on their web site.

With these type guns not only will you have a fantastic and versital gun but also one that will gain substantial appreciation the longer you keep it. Take care of that Parker DHE and it will double in value before your eyes.

Best of luck on your quest.

Brad

You might be surprised at how soon non-toxic only shot regulations will be upon you.

No 12 will look like too much of a mistake, when compared with a 20, when that day comes.

Just a thought.
Best,
Ted

Only very few DHEs make money - a picky crowd and hard to please too.
There's no shortage, but only the high original condition ones are wanted by the players with the cash.
Anything less, and they're just another gun.

The way things are going I would seriously consider a steel rated 12 gauge that way you could be ready for anything the Government throws at you.
All the best

I have a friend with a mint condition Sauer sidelock, it's a postwar gun, either a 12 or 16 (don't remember) and he's looking to sell it. It's well within your range.

If interested I can put you in touch with him. Send me an email.

recoil@optonline.net

Dave, I may have a gun you might be interested in. I am down the street from you in Royal Oak ...email me denwolfe@sbcglobal.net

Hi and welcome to the forum, lots of great folks here and lost of wonderful info - I love this forum and I'm sure you will also.

Anyway, my 2c worth. For the kind of money your talking you have so many wonderful choices you can make. As others have said and I will here, look at some of these makers:

Garbi
Grulla
AyA (No 1)
Arreita
Perhaps a good used Arrizabalaga (The Purdey of Spain)
Any of the well known English makers (this guns are lightweight in a 12, but remember most come with 2 1/2" chambers).

Look around on the various sites. After all looking is most of the fun!!

I would also consider a 16ga (my favorite), but if I had to choose between a 12 or 20, go 12.

Again, welcome and good luck - keep us posted!

All the best!

Greg

Consider going to one of the several double gun events where there are double gun shooters about, guns for sale and targets to be shot. Do that before you go and buy something blind. You need to 'test the water first' in order to make a determination based on more than just well intended advice .. a bit of first hand trigger pulling should be requisite.

Merkel makes a 16/20 .. a 16ga. on their 20ga. frame. McBrides on Lamar in Austin,TX has had them. You might call & speak w/Joe if that interests you.

On a new gun it will be close to impossible to try it out beforehand, so the trick is to find someone who has a gun aleady that you might try. Gun clubs & events are the classic way to do that. Some dealers will let you shoot a used gun that is for sale; polite protocol says you ask first to avoid any issues.

Just some thots, perhaps something of value to you. Good luck in your quest and welcome aboard.

Welcome Dave,
I know you said new...but,,,,
Would a lovely older Gun turn you on at all?
If you're willing to pay 8-10 Grand..you could ,I'm sure, with some hard looking find a wonderful condition Gun from a fine English/Belgian maker.
You would for sure get one hell of a nice vintage Boxlock or Sideplated gun for that.An even nicer HammerGun.
There are good little-used lovely old guns out there..many with original 2 3/4 chambers
Good luck with your selection
cheers
franc O

Lowell,
While I agree with you that the high condition untouched Parkers like all other collectors sxs's will always be the most sought after and valued of the lot I don't agree that the less valued Parkers like one that may be all original but let's say with a well done wood re-finish are " just another Gun".
My point to Dave was more the fact that a new Uggie,Merkel or most other nice quality new SXS's in his price range will likely not lose value but will not appreciate much over the years like a good quality Parker,Elsie etc and to say otherwise contradicts the entire used American SXS market.

Respectfully,
Brad

Try Looking at British Sporting Arms web site. Charles and Margaret have a very nice selection. While the Various Spanish, Italian, German, American, ETC guns are very nice, there is something about the feel and balance of a Brit gun that is hard to duplicate.

Lowell, there's a lot of BS that floats around when it comes to Parkers and you're helping spread it.

One of the biggest lies Parker collectors like to feed each other is that only high condition guns are truly collectible, and they are the only ones that show strong appreciation. It's just not the truth.

Dave, I just picked up a new Merkel 47SL (their basic sidelock) in 12ga, new, for well under your budget. In fact, got it for about what an AyA #2 sells for, and at that price I think it's a very good buy. Take your time shopping; decide whether you want vintage or new. Actually, some of the best bargains fall into the "in-between" category best described as "newer used". With the latter, you don't need to worry about short shells, low pressure shells . . . shoot factory American stuff. And compared to new--although you can find some pretty good buys if you look, as I did with my Merkel--there's a real price advantage because the Euro is currently so strong against the $.

Take your time. Don't hesitate to ask questions about specific guns. You won't find anything out there that someone here--probably a lot of people here--hasn't owned.

That Schwandt Arms Daly 16 is nice but the vent rib looks way out of place.

Look around and fondle as many as possible,kinda like dating you want to test drive the blondes brunettes and the red heads and see what ya like.I find the auctions a good place to get a nice double,that and on the sale board here are better place then most dealers.
Enjoy the hunt and watch out you will not stop with 1 or 2
best,
Dave

Thanks again for all the input. I'm in no hurry and plan on researching all the different suggestions made. I'll be taking my time and visiting the web sites and calling dealers. This is my 1st purchase at this level so I plan on being thorough. I appreciate the time you all took to respond. I'm looking forward to the day that I can contribute something back to the forum. I'm sure you'll be getting more questions from me before this is done!

Dave