doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Shooting ducks with a Paradox

I'm writing an article on an 1897 H&H Paradox 12 bore hammer gun that I have to play with at the moment.

I took it on a duck flight last week at dusk and thought a report may interest one or two here.

Basically, ducks at 30-35 yards were not folding and hitting the deck. Ducks at 20-25 yards were. The former were planing down 100 yards away.

I picked six mallard- two dead and four crippled.

My contention is that the Paradox rifled choke messes with the pattern enough to weaken it much beyond 25 yards.

I will later pattern it with the Eley Maximum bismuth No.3 and No.4 shot 1 1/4oz ammo I was using. Also, with Gamebore Pure Gold 1oz of lead No.7 for comparison.

I may well try it on partridges for one drive on Wednesday and see if it does a job on them.

The gun is a back-action hammer nitro Paradox. Weighs around 8lbs and handles as a shotgun well enough.

If I recall, H&H claimed that its Paradox gave results with (UK) #6 shot as good as a shotgun. Possible issue with using larger shot?

Regards

Smallbore,
I think your current results should already tell you quite a lot about what 'spin' does to a pattern at middle to longish distances.

I think H&H publicity regarding patterns from paradox guns needs to be taken with a huge pinch of salt. It should work well on partridges though!

As a point of interest - I assume you need permission to use a section 1 firearm on the land you'll be shooting on (even with shot cartridges)?

A friend of mine has a Paradox that I believe is just a bit older than the one you mention. It patterns IC at 40 yds.
Jim

Jim from Trafalgar. Just wondering ,"Is that a Back-lock Hammer H&H that your friend Owns? Just Curious Not too many Paradox gun in that part of Indiana. (ref,Sir Weller Woods)Crossedchisles.

Russell - I am a Registerd Firearms Dealer with permission to test guns either in the field or on ranges. This experiment constitutes 'testing'.

Smallbore,
I have a much later super magnum paradox by William Evans and am interested in your results. Are you using fiber wads or plastic shot cups? I want to try patterning mine with some 2 3/4" fiber wad shells like it was designed to shoot. Very , Very interesting stuff.
Steve

I don't know, but for me it's clear and I read it somewhere long time ago, that paradox choked guns are not effective for long distance shooting. I guess it's o'key for small birds shooting to fix fast eating in fields or in African camps between buffs and lions shootings and that's it.

This Paradox is nitro-proofed for 2 1/2" shells. I used fibre wad Eley cartridges of nominal 2 1/2" proof (67mm case length).

The gun has very steep forcing cones, or tapered chambers, which result in the plastic cases becoming slightly feathered at the ends when fired.

With true 65mm cases, I expect the problem to go away.

The next plan is to take it to Corsica to shoot wild boar - H&H have kindly offered me a box of ammo to use.

FWIW, using modern trap loads with plastic one piece wads I have found that the Briley 'Diffuser' screw-in chokes [rifled vis a vis Paradox fashion] pattern in the 'Improved Cylinder' range.

Use of some types of card wads, e.g. the Ljutic 'Mono Wad' or the Remington plastic 'post' wad with a .200 hard card wad placed over the shot gave somewhat more open patterns. In the first case I suspect it was the rifling biting into some of the shot and deforming it and in the second that the thick card wad acted as a momentary air brake helping to disperse the shot. I honestly could not make any conclusive statements other than to say that tight patterns in the modified range seemed well outside their realm and that if they did any real diffusiing it was quite beyond my efforts to observe it happening. Perhaps tighter patterns could be achieved if using steel shot wads with hard high quality shot, but that would seem to defeat any purpose of having a diffuser effect.

OTOH, I also had a Chapuis 20 with Raye boring that would throw nice even and open cyl patterns with most anything put through it. Go figure.