May
S M T W T F S
1 2 3 4
5 6 7 8 9 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28 29 30 31
Who's Online Now
7 members (Jem Finch, LGF, MattH, battle, Borderbill, 1 invisible), 1,077 guests, and 4 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums10
Topics38,512
Posts545,664
Members14,419
Most Online1,344
Apr 29th, 2024
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 33 of 55 1 2 31 32 33 34 35 54 55
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,816
Likes: 194
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,816
Likes: 194
I'm a decendent of the Celts and/or Germanic folk but I don't put much stock in the pagan holiday. If you find a copy of "The Gun, 1934", please let me know. I browsed ABE books last night and it looks like I am going to have to sell a few doubles(or not purchase for a while) to fund a book buying spree. The scanned web books are quite nice, but very little compares to the smell, as well as being able to turn the foxed pages of an original, possibly not a first edition, text.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Last edited by ellenbr; 10/15/07 02:15 PM.
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Originally Posted By: revdocdrew
And he's suppose to be off bird hunting right now-who is driving the car while you're on the lap-top Pete, the DOG?!?

(and it's extremely unlikely that any of us could purchase that stuff today! Check http://books.google.com/books?id=y08P3GE...5x7s1lubGl-1gSM )


Next week.
40 flushes per hour if this is to be believed:
http://www.pricecountywi.net/conditions/outdoors.html



Pete

PeteM #61205 10/15/07 02:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,816
Likes: 194
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,816
Likes: 194
PeteM:

We have to chat Shorthairs sometime as I have a black gyp with white ticking(among the other 5 various ones). I think I would like a Wirehair, but it is just too hot in Alabama. It will be 2 weeks for me until Kansas.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,428
Likes: 315
Sidelock
***
OP Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,428
Likes: 315
More very interesting Greener stuff. The latest Julia's auction included a Greener SxS Item # 3274 with the top rib stamped "Inventor of Laminated Steel" !? Unfortunately, date of manufacture was not included. I've found no patents for barrel steel for Greener BUT this from The Science of Gunnery, as Applied to the Use and Construction of Fire-Arms by W.W. Greener, 1841 may be Greener’s description of his claim for inventing Laminated Steel:
“I have had as high as three-fourths of steel to one of iron, and where proper attention is paid to clipping of the steel to pieces, corresponding with the (horse-nail) stubs, and properly mixing the whole, welding (in an air furnace) and forging by the heavy hammer, reducing by a tilt ditto, and rolling down to the…rod, a most excellent, tenacious, and dense body of iron is obtained; while, by cutting into lengths of 6 inches, bundling a number together, and re-welding them into a bar, you gain an increased density and tenacity…rendering it…considerably more powerfully strong than any explosive fluid ever yet compounded could burst…”

I also found The Mechanics Magazine, Museum, Register, Journal and GazetteJuly, 1849 Ed. J.C. Robertson
"Paper read on the Manufacture of the Finer Irons and Steel, as Applied to Gun-Barrels..."
Greener described a new method of barrel production using scrap steel from old coach springs.

And more great reading available on-line
The Science of Gunnery, as Applied to the Use and Construction of Fire-Arms 1841 Oxford
http://books.google.com/books?id=ThYkeKlemD8C&dq=w+greener+barrel+patents

“The Syrians were formerly celebrated for their skills in working of iron. Damascus barrels were not to be obtained, at certain periods, at a price less than their weight in silver. The elaborate mixtures of their barrels, swords, &c., entitle them truly to the honour of being the best iron workers…”

“Mr Hallam refers to the authority of an Arabic author…that there is no question that the knowledge of gunpowder was introduced into Europe through the means of Saracens (used to refer to Arabs living in Northern Sinai and a generic term for Moslems) before the middle of the 13th century…”
Greener dates the first use of cannon by the English to the battle of Werewater in 1327 and the invention of portable fire-arms by Italians in 1430.

A reference to the Epistle of the Secret Arts of Friar Bacon is found on p.18

“Our manufacture of inferior gunnery has certainly reached a depth of infamy which never any manufacture in the world reached…”

“Mr Whitehouse, of Wednesbury…has succeeded in obtaining a figure, or as late writers have termed it, “Watering or Jowher”, attests the attention and assiduity he must have devoted to the subject, for the variety is great and handsome…
A many conjectures have been advanced, and an endless discussion created, to account for the Watering or Jowher in oriental sword blades, and genuine Damascus barrels. Anything approaching the truth is seldom met with…”
“The most endless variety possible may be attained; a figure with the carbonized material, showing only the ends or edges of various lamina, or portions of the face of that lamina, may with equal facility be obtained…
It would be a never-ending task…to endeavour to describe a tithe of the varieties that might be made, and have been. The French and Belgians are very expert at this sort of ornamental work.
I have clearly shown, that whatever other qualities Damascus possesses, strength is not one of its properties.”



Last edited by revdocdrew; 10/15/07 09:09 PM.
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,428
Likes: 315
Sidelock
***
OP Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,428
Likes: 315
Gloria a Dios found this C.G. Bonehill (unfortunately without date of manufacture) on an old Greg Martin auction site. The pattern very much looks like that illustrated in Greener's book for the early 1800s English Mr Wiswoulds Iron Barrels-linear rather than scroll. This may represent the earliest attempt at Laminated steel (which looks like herring-bone.) Anyone with a similar pattern?? date of manufacture of your gun?


Last edited by revdocdrew; 10/16/07 11:00 PM.
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Figel, "On Damascus Steel"
Figel has a picture of a matchlock rifle from India, circa 1700. He identifies the pattern as herringbone. It bears a close resemblance to the Bonehill barrels. However, the method of fabricating the barrels was very different. I believe this matchlock is held by the Victoria and Albert Museum. So is it possible it was on display when that Bonehill was made?

Henry Blochmann, Henry Sullivan Jarrett, "The Ain i Akbari By Abū al-Fazul ibn Mubārak", Published 1873
Detailing the rule of Akbar about 1590 A.D. in India. Akbar took great interest in the fabrication of firearms.

From Volume 1 of 5.
Quote:
ON MATCHLOCKS
These are in particular favour with His Majesty, who stands unrivalled in their manufacture, and as a markman. Matchlocks are now made so strong, that they do not burst, though let off when filled to the top. Formerly they could not fill them to more than a quarter. Besides, they made them with the hammer and the anvil by flattening pieces of iron, and joining the flattened edges of both sides. Some left them, from foresight, on one edge open but numerous accidents were the result, especially in the former kind, His Majesty has invented an excellent method of construction. They flatten iron, and twist it round obliquely in form of a roll, so that the folds get longer at every twist then they join the folds, not edge to edge, but so as to allow them to lie one over the other, and heat them gradually in the fire. They also take cylindrical pieces of iron, and pierce them when hot with an iron pin. Three or four of such pieces make one gun or, in the case of smaller ones, two. Guns are often made of a length of two yards those of a smaller kind are one and a quarter yards long, and go by the name of bamdnak. The gunstocks are differently made. From the practical knowledge of His Majesty, guns are now made in such a manner that they can be fired off, without a match, by a slight movement of the cock.

These cylindrical pieces can be used to form yet another pattern that has no equivalent in Europe. It is known as the "Circle and Rose", which Figel has pictures of as well as diagrams of fabrication techniques that may have been used.

Pete

Last edited by PeteM; 10/16/07 10:31 PM.
PeteM #61452 10/17/07 01:14 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 227
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 227
Pete-

Very good information there! Thanks for the research.

Doug

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,428
Likes: 315
Sidelock
***
OP Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,428
Likes: 315
Another pic of the Bonehill with the interesting barrel pattern



And the Maker's Case Label



Can anyone suggest the approximate date of manufacture?

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,138
Likes: 200
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,138
Likes: 200
Raimey, my non typical coated Wirehair will lie in the sun for hours. She would love to live in Alabama. Seriously, many breeders of Wirehairs end up with a short coated dog occasionally and would be glad to have someone like you pay good money for it. I have seen a picture of such dogs on a Wirehair website. They describe the trait as "not approved for breeding". Who cares? My pup has all the attributes of a normal Wirehair except long kinky hair. She looks like a black and white English Pointer with docked tail. Murphy

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954
Likes: 12
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954
Likes: 12
The Bonehill is most likely of the 1880 -1895 time frame. There is a good chance it came directly to USA in the relatively large orders of 1880-1890, before implementation of the McKinley tarriff of 35% plus $6. I have seen similar guns, but not that barrel pattern.

Page 33 of 55 1 2 31 32 33 34 35 54 55

Link Copied to Clipboard

doublegunshop.com home | Welcome | Sponsors & Advertisers | DoubleGun Rack | Doublegun Book Rack

Order or request info | Other Useful Information

Updated every minute of everyday!


Copyright (c) 1993 - 2024 doublegunshop.com. All rights reserved. doublegunshop.com - Bloomfield, NY 14469. USA These materials are provided by doublegunshop.com as a service to its customers and may be used for informational purposes only. doublegunshop.com assumes no responsibility for errors or omissions in these materials. THESE MATERIALS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANT-ABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT. doublegunshop.com further does not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials. doublegunshop.com shall not be liable for any special, indirect, incidental, or consequential damages, including without limitation, lost revenues or lost profits, which may result from the use of these materials. doublegunshop.com may make changes to these materials, or to the products described therein, at any time without notice. doublegunshop.com makes no commitment to update the information contained herein. This is a public un-moderated forum participate at your own risk.

Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without prior written consent of the Copyright holder. For specifics on Copyright Law and restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.0.33-0+deb9u11+hw1 Page Time: 0.092s Queries: 35 (0.063s) Memory: 0.8754 MB (Peak: 1.8989 MB) Data Comp: Off Server Time: 2024-05-10 00:52:08 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS