doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com BSS Sidelock...

...stupid tight.









Took my BSS Sidelock out to the range this past weekend. 12 gauge, 28", DT, English, Factory choked Full/Mod.
I loaded some Federal paper hulls with a 7/8 oz load with a spreader disks and had at em' on a Skeet field.
23 first round, 21 the second. All losses out of the left barrel.

Pulverized doesn't begin to describe how hard this gun hit clay.
With some 1 oz 1190 FPS paper loads, this little 6 1/2 lb marvel dusted birds out to 65 yards. Hmm.

I measured the bores, .728 right and .730 left.
4 inches of perfectly tapered choke each barrel.
Chokes measured .020 right (Mod) and .047 left(?).

Full = .035
XFull= .040

What the hell do you call .047 ??

Old standards called .040 full. Personally, I would call .047 "Full-A-Plenty"

12 points of constriction past Briley Full made me feel better about my Skeet misses

Bob, my Lindner Daly is .047/.047

When you figure out what to call it, let me know.

Maybe just a fudge tight .............. for a HE grade Super Fox duck gun. I've shot ducks with bismuth out of mine for many years. Killed a 6 duck limit with it, on Dec. 28 last year, with 6 shells.

If you're on 'im, it'll do the job. If you ain't, you can miss him with a "Cylinder".

SRH

Nice gun, Bob. I really don�t have a good use for a gun with that tight a choke, and I did look for a 26� BSS just for that reason.
Got pheasants? Good luck with the new gun.

Best,
Ted

In today's vernacular, XX Full. Card shooters use chokes that tight, and tighter, regularly. But, finding the appropriate load is super important.

Some card shooters use a barrel choked as much as .100". Now ............. what would you call that?

SRH

Would it be criminal to open the chokes a tad? If it is too tight for you, I don't think it is a bad thing to open it up a bit.

I have a 28" BSS Sidelock that had been opened to IC & Mod before I bought it. I think that decreased the value even though it made the gun more useable for me...Geo

In the Flynn article, file:///Z:/weber-old-web-2015/flynn/james_flynn_bss_sidelock_article_050104.htm

Mr. Flynn describes the chokes as Full/Mod but c'mon, I had no idea.
Massively Full choke with at 22 yards yielded a whopping 12 inch pattern.
A spreader disk provided a most wanting extra 2 inches.
7/8 oz of #9's at an incomer on either station 1 or 7 left nothing but vapor.

Why not make an attempt to improve one's shooting skills to the point that you could utilize the extremely tight choke better, rather than desecrating the choke as originally built?

What have you lost if you don't succeed? Even if you never get to the point that you can utilize .047" choke, you will likely be able to shoot better.

SRH

In a sense, it made it MORE valuable to you. But I understand the reluctance to do that. For me, it depends on each gun. Opening up an 8 lb gun to Sk/IC would be hard for me to justify, but a gun as tight as the BSS under consideration, not a problem - for me. I would not view it as a collectible, and it would be a nice upland hunting gun with a bit loser chokes.

If he opened it a tad he might hit 6 for 6....

Just saying.

True that, but it didn't help the market value any, IMHO...Geo

A Fiocchi Interceptor will likely open the pattern more than that.

SRH

I understand you Geo. If it was opened to M/F, it would be more valuable to me and I would pay more for it. But to a collector...

Are the constrictions actually stamped on the barrels? How are the chokes listed?

Brent, they have the original M & F stamps. My IC & Mod measurements are from a drop in Galazon gauge, so may not be exact. But the chokes are certainly more open than M & F...Geo

A fairly scarce double with a production total of 1100 guns, 700 12's and 400 20's.
These chokes must be how the Almighty intended them to be. For that reason I shall not alter them.
I consider them to be the "Immaculate Constriction".

Bob,
I'd like to offer my own opinion. Before getting my 12 & 20 BSS-SL's that have 26" barrels choked ic/mod, I bought my first sxs BSS boxlock sporter that was 28' with mod/full chokes. I thought it was a bit tight, but as I continued to shoot sporting clay's with it, I began to see the value in it's choking. Targets that were 30+ yards were no longer "questionably" hit, and I could actually see exactly where the targets were hit making me a somewhat better shooter.
I never considered it a skeet gun, and used it in an appropriated situation. It gave me confidence for Pheasants and suitable prairie game. Grouse and Woodcock get the ic/mod and skt/ic choked guns instead, along with the occasional round of skeet.
I think that you have a great gun for Pheasants and the prairie birds. I'll bet you'll find it perfect for longish SC courses.
Hope this helps,
Karl

Much wisdom in that post.

SRH

Tighter than the spandex on a 400 pound woman

700 12 gauges isn�t very many. I�m not going to mess with mine. I know it is a very overused term, but, these are a bargain.

Best,
Ted

Don�t forget that chrome lined barrels look like ass after they�ve been teamed.

Greg,
I don't believe that Browning chrome lined those barrels.
Karl

Even though fairly rare with 1100 total pieces, and being rather nice guns, I don�t know how �collectible� the Japanese made Browning BSS Sidelock shotgun really is, at least at this point in time. People are different, and some prefer 28� barrels over 26� for shooting/hunting. With that said, I have not heard of any of the 28� guns with open chokes from the factory. If I bought the 28� gun as a safe queen, I�d leave the chokes alone. If I bought it to hunt upland game over pointing dogs, esp Ruffed Grouse hunting, I�d open the chokes, and would have a pro do the barrel work. Plus, all those guns have 14 1/4� LOP. For me to shoot, I�d have to lengthen the stock to 15� LOP in a DT gun, and there again......goes away the originality.

Yep...they photograph well but for what they are 12 gauges are over priced.

65 yard SKEET targets? Well, I guess if I were to shoot skeet targets at 65 yards, then I certainly wouldn't want a gun choked skeet/skeet!

Whether to open a very tightly choked barrel . . . depends on what you want to do with the gun. For some reason, the Japanese choked Parker Repro 28ga guns with 28" barrels M/F . . . which might have been OK except for the fact that the constrictions they used are more appropriate for a 12ga than a 28ga. Even M/F constrictions for a 28ga are tighter than I want. But then my uses would be recreational skeet, grouse and woodcock, and quail. Might want those tighter chokes for doves, but I don't shoot them.

Unless your gun has "collectible" value, I see no reason not to open a choke that's tighter than you want for your intended purposes. Even when I was shooting a lot of wild pheasants, I didn't want anything tighter than maybe a tight mod in the L barrel of my sxs. That's because I don't intend to take shots beyond 40 yards. Increases the chances of crippling and losing a bird, even with a good dog.

On Japanese Parker Repros, here is a fine article by David Trevallion on the subject. Just been published in "Shooting Sportsman."

https://shootingsportsman.com/parkerrepro/

Some folks choose to listen to guys like Jack Haugh, Kirk Merrington, James Flynn, Abe Chaber, and George Hoenig, for opinions on the quality of the BSS sidelocks, and figure out for themselves what they should pay for one, instead of a blow hard with an SBE on an internet board. You have no idea what the subject gun cost.

Name another gun that is a Holland pattern sidelock, with chopper lump barrels, intercepting sears, Southgate ejectors, AND 2 3/4� chambers, that is a better deal, blow hard.

Go ahead.


Ted

I been trying to be nice to you Ted since you been sickly...(I'd hate for you to get your blood pressure up a pop something in yer eYe.)

Ive handled a few and I don't think they compare to an English sidelock in workmanship or feel...I can think they are over priced and you can think they're not.

Would it be nice if I called you a "blow hard" because you think a Mossburg pump is the finest pump gun ever made ?

Funny about a year ago the engraving made you feel cold...the thought of no chokes was a no no.

I guess all the criticism was you just being a "blOw hard" ?

Ted I'm just happy to see you finally graduate from the Darne shoots gun to a nice gun.

You've come a long way baby...

Maybe if you live long enough you'll graduate to a Spanish sidelock.

Arrizabalaga SLE round body vs a Browning BSS Sidelock.......Hmmmm.

The above guys, especially James Flynn, have all had mixed experiences with Spanish guns, and will straight out tell you so if you bother to ask.

They don�t feel that way about the Browning. To a one.

Good luck getting the Spaniard for the price Bob or I got the Browning�s.

Best,
Ted

Don�t care for the game scene engraving on the BSS sidelock. I�ve never been a fan of choke tubes.

What the hell are you babbling about?

Darnes didn�t and won�t go anywhere.

You get more clueless by the day.


Best,
Ted

OK Ted. But, keep in mind, Arrizabalaga isn�t the typical Spanish gun. Thanks for your opinion.

I'm talking about you down grading BSS about a year ago.

Do you never get tired of being the turd in the punchbOwl ?
How about you give it a rest jOe?

In your punch bOwl ?

Ted I was just thinking that BSS will be great for hot weather shooting....seeings how the egraving leaves you so cold.

Just a thought.

Hand engraved.

There exist two styles of engraving on the BSS sidelock, blow hard:



This style, I don�t care for. I�m just fine with the other, which, you would know, if Evelyn Wood hadn�t failed your dumb ass.

Best,
Ted

Ted, I like the BSS Sidelock. Think they're nice guns. That being said, I just bought a Grulla sidelock 20ga marketed by Orvis for $3,000. You won't come close to a BSS Sidelock in 20ga for that money.

NEW Spanish gun prices have really gone up. But there are some nice buys on the used market on Spanish guns. My Grulla is hand detachable (the BSS isn't); has an articulated front trigger (can't recall on the BSS); has bushed firing pins (can't recall if the BSS has those either); the bottom of the action body is rounded (which some people prefer); and the comb of the stock is not fluted (which I think Mr. Flynn mentions in his article, and which is a deviation from the British style). Which is "better"? Well, they're both nice guns. The only way to test reliability, if that's what we mean by "better", would be to put a bunch of shells through both of them. I have not done that with the Grulla, nor did I put a ton of shells through the BSS when I owned it. So I'm not really in a position to knock either of them when it comes to reliability.

On the other hand, any Parker Repro has much nicer wood than either of those . . . and some of the Repros have really spectacular wood, which is way beyond what you'd find on the BSS or on all but maybe the most expensive Spanish sidelocks. And they sell for a lot less than a BSS Sidelock in 20ga, and come in a nice case.

Lots of good guns out there, depending on one's tastes.

I got wood, Larry:



BSS sidelock wood. Haven�t seen a Repro top this.

Yes, Mr. Flynn said the fluted comp was not an English feature. Did you read between the lines in the same article about his opinion of Spanish guns? Ever heard Kirk, Abe, or Dewey wax poetic about Spanish guns? I have a notion on reliability of either, based on what these guys, and a few others say. Dewey has a great repair article involving an AYA number 2 on his blog. It is not confidence inspiring.

I�ve never seen a complaint about the mechanics or steel in a Japanese gun. Can�t say that about Spanish guns, up and downscale.

I horse traded into my BSS, but Bob says he got into his for about what a BSS boxlock goes for.

I wish you all the luck in the world with the Grulla. Sometimes you need it on a Spanish gun.

No articulated triggers or bushed strikers on the BSS sidelocks, it would be nice, but, not truly necessary. I never said it was the best gun, but, it represents a heck of a buy for a sidelock with 2 3/4� capability. I can make the LOP work, I get it that some guys can�t and won�t put a pad on. No go for them.


Best,
Ted

Ted you dog!
That's the nicest wood I've ever seen on any BSS.

It is nice...



too bad the engraving leaves him cold.

Ted, that is unusually nice wood for a BSS Sidelock. It'd rank at least average, maybe slightly above, if it were on a Parker Repro. Take a look at the Repros listed on gunsinternational, Ted, and--well, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, but if you're objective about it, you won't have any trouble finding better wood than yours. And the AVERAGE Repro has much nicer wood than the AVERAGE BSS Sidelock.

Bushed strikers not necessary? Ted, weren't you the same guy who knocked the Webley & Scott 700's because they didn't have those? Good German guns are also well thought of for their mechanics and steel. Yet I bought a Sauer with a busted hammer (no bushed strikers, and the seller agreed to have it fixed by Del Whitman). And you don't often hear of hammers on Sauers or Merkels or Simsons breaking either. . . but it does happen. Which was your point, I think, about Webley & Scott 700's . . . of which I've owned a few and have never had a broken hammer. But I do think the Model 400 I owned was a superior gun in that regard . . .because it did have bushed strikers.

Given that there are about a bazillion Spanish guns out there (quite a few of which were made to a price point) compared to 1100 BSS Sidelocks, frequency of repair is going to be tilted in the direction of the Spanish guns. And one does have to wonder . . . if BSS Sidelocks never break, why do we hear quotes praising them from gunsmiths? All that disassembly taking place purely for stripping and cleaning, or just out of curiosity to see what they look like inside?

I do agree--based more on Ithaca SKB's and Parker Repros than any other guns--that Japanese guns tend to be pretty darned reliable. Yet I also owned a Hibiki, which I think was a Miroku under an earlier name (and therefore out of the same factory that made the BSS) that had various mechanical issues. And when I did an article on Japanese guns, I talked to a gunsmith who said that while the Japanese-made Charles Daly OU's were pretty nice guns, he'd replaced broken leaf springs on a number of them.

So on sum, Japanese guns--in terms of reliability--are probably as good as Japanese cars and trucks. And I've owned a number of those, and they're darned good. But not perfect.

Talking about Teds wood is fighting words Larry...

Cold engraving....now average wood.

I'll give your 15 hundred for it Ted to help you out of your misery.

I knocked boxlocks with integral strikers/tumblers, Larry, because if one breaks, you are out of the game that year. If I had to, I could service the striker in a Holland pattern sidelock. Fact is, I have a spare for the BSS, and it just takes a screwdriver to do it. I won�t be repairing the integrated striker in a boxlock, however.
Has it occurred to you the subject here is a sidelock gun, not a boxlock? Further, that once the sidelock is out of the way, you have pretty easy access to the striker, something that is completely different in a boxlock? Disc set strikers are WAY more important in a boxlock, Larry.
Make a note of that. Your education continues.
Did you take a look at the spring Dewey repaired in the AYA, Larry? It was poorly made. That is not a cheap Spanish gun. I have a Spanish boxlock gun Larry, use it all the time, but, it cost me $400, and has disc set strikers AND the tool and spare strikers.
The Flynn article was done after he did a strip and clean to a customers BSS sidelock. He mentioned Abe Chaber in the article, as Abe agrees with Flynn about the BSS. I�m going to guess people with sidelocks are a bit more religious about getting them serviced than the run of the mill boxlock or, pump owner.
Good wood is where you find it. Having great wood on a Parker, or, Parker reproduction wouldn�t change the fact you are stuck with a Parker, a design I�m not overly impressed with, ESPECIALLY small bore and single trigger versions.


Best,
Ted

I�ll sell you a Stupid Black Eagle for $1500 DOLLARS. But, I actually doubt you have 1500 pennies.

Best,
Ted

I'm shocked Ted I didn't think you put that high a value on an Italian made SBE.

If that Japanese made BSS breaks do you have to send it back to Japan for repairs ?

If your Stupid Black Eagle breaks, do you send it to Italy to be repaired?

Dumbass.


Best,
Ted

In 19 years it's never broke down mr.Ted...

If it did I could fix it myself

Mr. Vicknair has a whole blog about guys like you and your �fixings�....

Best,
Ted

Fixing a SBE is as easy as putting a spark plug in a lawn mower.

I hate you're so hard up your willing to sell me your dad's SBE.

mr.Ted you want I should take up a collection for you....surely with all your Darne work I could find one guy to donate a couple bucks

Talk is cheap. Seen a stripped spark plug hole in a head or two in my day, they sell helicoils to fix what guys like you do...


Best,
Ted

I�d sell it to anybody else for $900. To you, $1500. Moot point, you haven�t got the scratch anyway....

Best,
Ted

That's your dad's gun a familiar air loom...don't sell it.

Got all his guns. This is the only one with a plastic bird picture on the grip cap.

You got weird notions of good taste. Wish I could say I�m surprised.

Best,
Ted

I've changed many a Spark Plug in lawn mowers with aluminum heads. Haven't had to have one heli-coiled yet. On the other hand, I knew a gentleman who sent his JD riding lawn mower to the dealer for servicing. They stripped the spark plug hole & then "Glued" the plug in. Needless to say the first time he tried to mow his yard it blew the plug out.

Around 40 years ago while hunting the Stirrup broke in the left lock of my J P Clabrough sidelock. I finished the hunt with a single shot. I, of course, didn't know just what was wrong then, only that the left barrel won't fire. When I got it home & took the lock off it was obvious what the problem was, so I made & fitted a new stirrup. I haven't had the lock off since & it has never failed to fire Yet.

Some of us are capable of doing a good bit of our own work. I have absolutely no idea what Joe's capabilities & doubt seriously that you do either.

He didn�t understand that metal was quenched in the case hardening process. He believes fine double guns are built from castings. He is completely clueless, and argued for about a dozen pages, with actual, English gunmakers, about what a screw grip action was. I�ve seen enough, here, to form my own opinion.
I could go on. But, I won�t.


Best,
Ted

If everyone was as smart as mr.Ted...

I bet it just kills you to know your dad saw something special in that Italian race horse of an automatic.

Ted, that sidelock striker repair is much easier, isn't it, if the locks are hand detachable . . . which they aren't on a BSS.

I believe--I'm going back quite a way in my memory--that it was Abe Chaber with whom I spoke about the Charles Daly OU's and broken leaf springs. Your praise of Japanese steel and technology didn't seem to be restricted to sidelocks only . . . which is a good thing, because if it were, you wouldn't be talking about very many guns. As compared, for example, to the Spanish gun industry.

Whether you're overly impressed or not with a Parker is irrelevant. And "especially the small bores"? Hmmm. Check the prices on Parker Repro 28's. If you do that, you will note that they run significantly higher than for 12's or 20's--even though they made more 28's than they did 12's. Those guns obviously have quite a few fans. And typically sell for bigger bucks than a BSS Sidelock 20. Which, I will again stipulate, is a pretty nice gun. But for some reason, hasn't seen the same price increase as a Repro 28--even though there are 10x more Repro 28's out there than BSS Sidelock 20's.

It would appear that the sxs buying public doesn't agree with your tastes. Nothing wrong with that. Somebody has to like Darnes!

Mr.Ted...don't it just kill you that Larry Brown is smarter than you.

Hmmm....

Good lord, Larry, you would actually find it easier to repair a striker in a sidelock that had a hand detachable lock plate, versus one with a screw?

Much easier? Are you sure? Have you done it? It is a piece of cake, assuming you have the RIGHT screwdriver, and, know which end to use.

The process is night and day different between an A&D boxlock and a Holland Pattern sidelock was my point, which, seems to have gone right over your head.

Smallbore Parkers look �pregnant� to me. They are oddly proportioned. The single triggers are hit or miss on the repros.

I really don�t care what the market says.

That said, if jOe comes to visit you in Wisconsin, the cumulative IQ in Wisconsin and Tennessee will both go down.


If you got any, keep him away from your screwdrivers.

Best,
Ted

That, is hilarious. Dad bought a 32� barrel for his Browning A5 standard, an aftermarket choke tube for same, that was supposed to be for steel BBB shot, and never looked back at the Benelli. It sat for YEARS without being used, same as now.

Race horse of a gun. What a joke. The Benelli is too light, too shiney, and too unreliable to ever be considered a waterfowl gun.

The Browning A5 always goes off.

$1600, special race horse pricing for you, clown boy. $800 to anyone else, here. Dave will get $20.


Best,
Ted

Thanks for the offer mr. Ted but I have two of them. Nair a break down or malfunction in 19 years on one and 16 on the other.

They are some complicated guns I can see why you would have trouble with one mr. Ted.

Well Ted, I have removed the locks from various hand-detachable sidelocks . . . with no tools whatsoever. And not having the right screwdriver means it's always quite possible to bugger a screw. Not a good thing on a relatively expensive gun.

So is it easier on an H&H patent sidelock than on a boxlock with bushings? Not sure about that, if you have the proper tool to remove the bushing. Certainly harder on either a Parker Repro or a Webley & Scott 700 . . . but I had a pair of A&N boxlocks made by Webley with disc-set strikers and the tool to pull the discs . . . and found striker replacement fairly easy.

Comparing prices on 28ga Repros to 20ga BSS Sidelocks simply means there are more people willing to pay more for the Repro. Maybe because it has about a half pound weight advantage over the BSS. Or maybe because for the price of an original Parker 28, you could buy several BSS Sidelocks.

Where are you to compare apples to apples and look at 20 gauge Winchester Parker repros versus 20 gauge Browning sidelocks
you would see that the Browning side lock sells somewhere between a 25 and 50% premium.

Never had a reason to use. I have shot it about four times( four ROUNDS, not four occasions), cleaned it, and put it away.

Their reputation as unreliable came long before I owned it. The glossy finish, the plastic bird puking on the grip cap, and the aluminum used in it�s construction boldly prove nobody every went broke under estimating American taste.

I am sure it fits you to a T.

Best,
Ted

I've been in the blind, or in the duck woods, with several SBEs that jammed. I don't pretend to know why. I haven't shot a recoil operated autoloader since I was 16 yrs old, and said "Goodbye" to the 20 ga. M11 Remington. But, I have been told that they "require liberal amounts of oil to run". That may or may not be accurate. I'm sure Frank will have an opinion on that.

SRH

Mine get a once or twice a year cleaning I use light grease on the bolt rails with a light oiling of the other parts....I do change the recoil spring every few years.
I've never took my SBE's duck hunting so I can't comment on how good a boat paddle they make.

Honestly duck hunting is okay but when I hunt I like it to last over an hour or so...and ducks in standing timber are big targets and easy shots when they're decoying.

If you're talking 20ga to 20ga, that's true. It's the Repro 28 that brings much bigger bucks. Although I like Repros in general, I'm not a fan of the 20ga. Too heavy. The only reason I have one is because it also has a set of 16ga barrels. As a 20ga, with 26" barrels, it weighs 6/10. Put on the 28" 16ga barrels and it loses a quarter of a pound. On the other hand, the 12's and the 28's--IMO--weigh about what they should.

mr. Larry....

mr.bOb don't like it when people makes him look dumb.

Larry,
If you are uncomfortable with gun screws and gun screwdrivers, admitting it is the first step. Good.
I�m not uncomfortable with either.
My point, which you have missed about three times now, is that bushed strikers are far less important on a Holland pattern sidelock, then they are on an A&D boxlock.
Changing strikers in an A&D boxlock, with disc set strikers, assuming you have the tool, or in a Holland pattern sidelock, assuming you can run a screwdriver, competently, is about the same level of difficulty. Not hard.

That would appear to be a hell of an assumption on this board. Dewey was right.

Integral strikers/tumblers, as used on many boxlocks, are a great idea, until they break. Then, you are down. The two broken integral strikers I have been around were both Webleys, by the way. They both broke in the middle of hunting trips.

The post was about the sidelock BSS, and somehow we ended up with a bunch of rot about Parker�s, and Parker repros, and what they sell for. Which, is a stupid path to go down, because those guns sell for the money they do based on collector interest. If you want a sidelock action to hunt with, that doesn�t break the bank, and has a great reputation, with actual gunsmiths, for being well built and bulletproof, you are going to look hard to find one that beats the BSS, on any criteria save collectibility. Which, may or may not change in the future.

The Spanish guns, have been recognized as a dice roll for a very long time now, at any level. I�ve rolled those dice, and didn�t lose, but, I�m done with that. You aren�t going to get a Spanish sidelock for a whole lot less than the Browning. But, you might just get internal parts that look like the spring in the blog Dewey posted. Evidence of my point, that is lacking on the Japanese Browning sidelock, by the way.

Nobody with skin in the game feels that it is hit or miss with the BSS sidelock. I guess if I needed a longer LOP or more open chokes, I would do it. I hate altering guns, but, I hate it less than a gun that doesn�t fit. But, as it is, I don�t have to do either. Having a gun built to fit would cost way more than the Browning, and I can use it as is, thankfully.

I wish you good luck with the Spanish gun. Shoot it in good health. It would seem jOe is over his SXS double phase, the sleevers won.

Best,
Ted

You really should get out more mr.Ted...nothing wrong with a properly sleeved gun.

mr.Ted I'm betting you'd shoot better with an O/Ur...but there is the sxs kOol factor to contend with.

I do commend you for stepping up from your Darne shoots gun...you'll look a lot kOoler.

Just saying

Tell us more about the Purdey 10 gauge sleever, that went off face, posthaste, shooting 12 gauge loads in chamber mates, jOe.

I never get tired of hearing that one. Especially the part where you stuck your buddy with it.

I have an O/U, jOe. Have shot it since 1975, if I was going to tear up a sporting clays course with it, I�d know it by now.

I still shoot a Darne, jOe. Always have, always will. You can take some solace in the fact it is an actual mono block gun, something every sleever pretends to be.

Best,
Ted

I don't recall the Purdey going off face nor did I stick anyone with it.
I did have a 10ga. Scott hammer gun that went off face.

mr.Ted it's evident to me that you've let hateful yelousy
over take yer senses.

Example yer jealous of mr. Larry because he's smarter when it comes to guns than you are...you're jealous of the Purdey I owned. It's been stuck in your brain for 10 years.

mr.Ted did you miss the part in the Bible about not coveting thy neighbor ?

Just saying...

Everyone is coveting a Purdey that has the word �Sleeved� stamped into the side of the breech end jOe.

Everyone.

Larry seems to have fessed up to having trouble with screws. Hero�s are where you find �em, glad you have a new one. Pretty sure he doesn�t have an SBE, you will have to reckon with that.

You have got me all wrong,
I covet nothing, need to move some stuff, as a matter of fact. Want an SBE? Buy it now price $1700 for you. $750 to anyone else. $20 to Dave when you pony up.
Maybe you can talk Larry into buying it for you.

You have a lot of things all wrong.

Best,
Ted

Ted, my point about removing screws apparently is escaping you. Not a good idea to pull one of the couple screwdrivers I have out of my vehicle tool kit and go to work on a nice shotgun. You need the RIGHT screwdriver . . . and while I've got them at home, I don't carry them with me on a hunting trip. I did carry the tool to remove the bushings on my A&N (Webley & Scott) pair. It stayed right in the original motor case in which they resided, along with replacement strikers. But with a hand detachable sidelock, you don't need a screwdriver at all.

And if someone told you that Parker Repros sell for what they do based on their collectible value, they're pulling your leg. An original Parker 28 in almost any kind of shape, or any high grade original Parker, or even a Trojan or a VH that's in unusually good condition--yes. Repro--no, unless it's either unfired or one of the higher grade guns. The Repro 28's bring the money they do because original 28's bring ridiculous prices, and because they're darned nice hunting guns. Based on the number produced, a BSS Sidelock--especially in 20ga--ought to have far more collector value. But they're both Japanese guns--which don't tend to cause significant heart throbbing on the part of American collectors. Even though American hunters recognize them as darned good field guns. I've owned several Repro 28's loved to tote them around, have put quite a few rounds through them after grouse, woodcock, and quail. But I've since moved in the direction of light 20's, and Repro 20's ain't light.

And I got the Spanish sidelock for $1500 less than your average 20ga BSS Sidelock sells for. Orvis marketed the gun, and Grulla made it. Both give me a certain amount of confidence--as does the fact that I've had the locks off (without a screwdriver) and taken a look at the internals.

Larry,
I have a spare striker and spring for the BSS. Why would I not carry the correct screw driver on a hunting trip, after going to the effort to procure that, and put in in the case with the gun?

If a Parker repro 28 brings the money they do because the originals bring a ton more, doesn�t that validate the fact that collector demand is driving that market, not to mention, my point about same?

Best,
Ted

Larry I hope mr.Ted shoots better than he comprehends or he'll never hit anything.

mr. Ted if I had a gun that I didn't have the confidence in to take hunting without toting along a tool kit I'd sell it quick.

Good luck selling your SBE.

The first years the guns were made they were known for problems...
I had sense enough to wait untill Benelli had the bugs worked out before I bought one.

The Brits built guns with cases full of tools, jOe. They were called �Bests�.

What was your point?


Best,
Ted

How many shells do you think you've put through that SBE, Frank?

SRH

Have no idea.

The understatement of the decade, on so many levels...

Best,
Ted

I didnt know Stan was a SBE X'spurt...I shoot shotguns 2 to 3 days a week sometimes more. I've got a 24" mobile choked barrel and a newer 28" crio barrel I shoot on it.
I shoot it about once a month (100 rds plus) on sporting clays sometimes more...nare a hick up with 1 oz loads as long as they are 1250fps...it gobbles up any magnum load.

It's 19 years old been refinished once.
It's not the only gun I shoot or hunt with....if I knew you wre going to ask I wouldve kept notes.

Does that help in your SBE research mr.Stan ?

I guess mr.Ted can tell us how many shots he's fired out of his Darne shoots gun.

Don't worry Snuffy. You are safe in your holler. Stan ain't no revenuer.

Stans yer gO to guy on a Yiltz but he's no SBE X'spurt.

How many rounds you shot through yer prized yilt'Z
mr. Stanley ?