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JOe'fewshus say...

Man get so full of self he for get go bathroom....for long chit back up and man be so full of chit he stink but he know smell.

Just saying Larry Clown


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Originally Posted By: craigd
Originally Posted By: L. Brown
....you'll likely find more shooters in lower classifications versus higher ones. Which means they possess lesser skills . . . maybe just as "serious"....

....I do shoot all winter, which requires some degree of "seriousness" if you happen to live in northern WI.

And I don't think I've ever seen anyone change their FRONT hand position between shots at pairs (I know that I don't) due to shooting a DT gun....

It's not a big deal Larry.

I mentioned the 'winner' as the yardstick to pin down how I was using the term "serious". I wasn't thinking about lower classification seriousness, though clearly through scoring, there is a difference, right?

You mentioned pump guns. Have you ever shot a double with one without moving your front hand? I one hundred percent take your word that you are a serious shooter, but you were the one that had the story about not getting off a second shot because you didn't know the gloves you chose were inappropriate. Maybe, you weren't serious enough to win on that day, or maybe you weighed the value of the fun of being there.

Remington 1100's aside, you previously mentioned it was impossible to not get off a second shot on DT gun as long as you can squeeze a finger in? C'mon Larry, if I'm not mistaken, you've given out advise about getting DT's serviced. Think about it Larry, us fellows that don't get out much, sit around and read stuff from the gun writers.

I appreciate the follow up comments, but weren't you making a point about competion shooting choices not mirroring side by sides and double triggers?


Well Craig, if your definition of serious is only "the winner", then you're not talking about very many shooters, are you?

As for moving your hand with a pump . . .well, obviously. But your hand is in the same position for both SHOTS. If it isn't, you just short shucked your gun and you won't get off a 2nd shot. Your front hand moves BETWEEN shots, but has to return to the same place it was for the first shot in order to get off a 2nd shot.

Shooting in northern WI in the winter, it's likely you're going to wear gloves. Possible to trap a trigger with a glove on a ST double (whether OU or sxs)? Sure. Impossible to do so if you shoot a DT gun. But then you have to make sure there's enough space between the triggers or you have another problem. When shooting in cold weather, you pays your money and you takes your chances. But then most of the really "serious" competitive events in this part of the world don't take place during the winter.

And ALL guns--ST or DT, pump or auto--require servicing from time to time. I hope to heck you're not suggesting that a ST double--OU or sxs--requires less attention than a double with DT.

Last edited by L. Brown; 02/19/19 08:29 AM.
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Originally Posted By: L. Brown
If you look at the classifications of shooters at a big shoot (I've both scored and pulled at the Wisconsin Iron Man, where there will be several hundred shooters), you'll likely find more shooters in lower classifications versus higher ones.


When I read this (mis)statement it jumped right out at me as being in error. I shoot in several big shoots a year but, more importantly, I watch the scores at many others to see how several of my friends and acquaintances do. I have known for many years that the largest number of shooters in any class at a big shoot is the Master class, which is the highest class. Next in high number of participants is the AA class, which is second from the highest. This holds true at almost every big shoot of 300 participants or more. The possible exceptions are the shoots where guns and stuff are given away for every class, three deep, like the NWTF shoots, or DU shoots.

If you want to lump AA,A,B,C,D and E together and call them the "lower classifications", then sure there will be more in them, all added together, than there will be in Master class alone. But, since you said "higher ones", plural, you had to be talking about, at the very least, M and AA .............with the rest being the "lower classifications". And, your statement is wrong in that regard.

You can go on either ScoringPro or WinscoreOnline and look at the total number of entrants in every class at every major shoot in the US. Go there and look for yourself at the numbers. Master is always, by far, the biggest class at a major shoot, sometimes making up over 25% of the total of all the classes, by itself. Add M and AA together and you are way over 50%.

Maybe you should go by the real numbers on the registrations, Larry, and not so much by your impressions as a scorer and trapper, or be a little more specific about what you call the higher, and the lower, classes. I've got no interest in the specific debate for which you intended that statement. I just wanted everyone who does not participate in these big shoots to know the actual numbers. Look for yourself under "Tournament results"......

http://www.winscoreonline.com

........... or, "View Scores"

https://www.scoringpro.com

SRH


Last edited by Stan; 02/19/19 09:30 AM.

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Well Stan, I guess we're just exceptions to the rule up here in the North Woods. Wisconsin Ironman: 332 entrants, of which 47 were M and 23 were AA. Not a NWTF/DU/PF/QF/RGS shoot or anything like that. Wisconsin State Sporting Clays Championship: This one is closer, and M was the biggest class with 92. But there were 330 entrants, and only 155 of them were M or AA. So not a majority in that shoot either.

Maybe we just plain have more guys shooting who aren't real seriously into competition.

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Larry, I went to the WI state shoot last year. Lots of Kolar guns and even more real good shots, is what I noticed.


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You guys are both correct. the difference is the Wisconsin iron man shoot maybe a large local shoot but it is not a major shoot.

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John, note that the Ironman draws almost exactly the same number of shooters as the state Sporting Clays Championship. And it draws them in spite of the fact that it is a 400 bird two day shoot, with 100 birds shot at each of 2 clubs (70 miles apart) on one day, and the other 200 at another club the other day--that club being 130 miles away from the furthest of the other 2. All 3 of those clubs are located in the northern third (and least populated part) of the state, while Wisconsin's major population centers are all in the southern third. Put all that together and it doesn't add up to a very good plan to attract over 300 shooters if it were just a "local" shoot.

Last edited by L. Brown; 02/20/19 10:39 AM.
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It's a very popular local shoot. but it's not a major shoot. there is a huge difference.

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John, just how does a guy from SC determine that a sporting clays shoot in Wisconsin with as many participants as the state championship shoot isn't a major shoot? It's a registered shoot. They're shooting sporting clays. What's the "huge difference"? What defines a "major shoot"? Seems like participation would be one consideration.

And "local"? My dictionary defines that term as "not widespread". Well, you've got a spread of 130 miles or so from Navarino on the east to Medford on the west. That's a pretty fair spread right there. But shooters come to the Ironman from well outside that already quite widespread "local" area.

Last edited by L. Brown; 02/20/19 05:15 PM.
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Don't argue with Larry. He is civil but relentless...Geo

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