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1 members (AGS),
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Forums10
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69 |
Hello the crew. Well it looks like I own a WW Greener 12 Bore rifle. I was at the Game Fair in London over the weekend, and a WW Greener 12 Bore rifle followed me home. Hammer Gun Damascus Steel Barrels Recent Birmingham nitro proof Jones underlever Fully rifled bores 3 Leaf sight. 12x65 chambers Antique (Pre 1898 ) Now what? Anybody got any info ? I have sent an email to Graham Greener, but gun came with no info. So bullet weight and style and dram requirements are a mystery. Should be fun. Nitro
Last edited by nitro450exp; 07/31/17 08:45 AM.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,991 Likes: 402
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,991 Likes: 402 |
Love those hammers and firing pins. Interesting system. Enjoy it!
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69 |
Sorry crappy pictures, rain and overcast. Tent was too dark and outside was wet. Best I could do was balancing an my haunches but it was not steady so very blurry.
Nitro
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,991 Likes: 402
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,991 Likes: 402 |
The weight of the gun along with rate of twist should be a good starting point. Hard to tell from photos but it does not look to be overly heavy. If the twist is slow I would start out with groove diameter RB and a mild charge working up. Best of luck, that is a pretty rifle. Steve
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,701 Likes: 99
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,701 Likes: 99 |
Better tie a string to your hat when you shoot that one. Nice looking gun though...Geo
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69 |
No need I shoot big stuff all the time. (577NE, 12 Bore, 20 Bore, 470NE, Slugs)
Nitro
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 12
Boxlock
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Boxlock
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 12 |
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 388 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 388 Likes: 1 |
What a lovely thing. Ideal for mice in the feed store !
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 704 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 704 Likes: 1 |
Nice gun! Congratulations!
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,083 Likes: 35
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,083 Likes: 35 |
Curious, were you able to bring it back with you because it was an antique?
My problem lies in reconciling my gross habits with my net income. - Errol Flynn
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69 |
I would be able to, but I am not coming back soon or directly from the UK.
Nitro
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 11,334 Likes: 388
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 11,334 Likes: 388 |
That's a lovely old gun, and an interesting and elegant solution for retracting the strikers.
I wish I could offer you some information on loading and shooting it. But I did recently read some things about loading for the bore rifles in a DGJ article by Ross Seyfreid from the Winter 1999 issue. He said the majority were built for use with round balls and paper cases. He felt it was most important to do a chamber cast to get chamber and throat dimensions, and to check the rate of twist of the rifling to determine the most suitable projectile, and whether it was built for paper or thin brass cases. He seemed to think black powder was the one and only propellant to use in the bore rifles.
A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69 |
Keith,
I will be slugging the bore and casting the chambers and throats as soon as I get back to the US. I also will be making a new striker for the left side, that one is a poor replacement. The one on the right is taller and more dome shaped and I believe it to be original. The one on the left also does not sit concentrically in the cavity, as I said a poor attempt.
The proof house has offered the following information. Prooved with 740gr Fosbery type slug, Max pressure 740 Bar.
Ofcourse the did not offer any feedback on how it shot or the nominal bore of the slug, and as it was 30% overloaded I would not have expected it to regulate.
Yes lots to do before the adventure can begin.
Nitro
PS: I have all the DGJ's so I will be doing some research through the index's.
Last edited by nitro450exp; 08/11/17 04:12 AM.
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 69 |
She is waiting on export permit at the exporter. Nitro
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Posts: 1,737
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
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Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 4
Boxlock
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Boxlock
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 4 |
Hi, I came across this discussion (and your ‘confession’) by chance, and it made me register for this forum. Congratulations on the rifle. I have about the same (as well as an almost identical by Webley & Son). Yours is however in original condition with the retracting strikers as patented by Greener in 1868 (patent no. 800, March 7.1868) W.W. Greener didn’t like striker springs (nor rebounding locks ..). He described this rifle in ‘Modern Breechloaders’ page 100 and following pages. He suggests an 11-bore round ball or a –hollow point or massive- conical bullet (same as for Paradox). The right-hand twist of the 11 lands will probably something like 1: 4ft 5, the grooves being approx. 0,08”deep. You’ll probably find “Sighted with 4 Drams of Powder “ on the action. I assume this goes for the 11-bore ball as mentioned by Greener. Castbulletengeneering in Australia can supply you with moulds for both round ball and 12-bore Paradox. Brass must be available in the States. I use 4 dram (7 gram, we’re in France …!) Swiss BP nr 3 (2FG) + some wads and a bit of grease. Shoots well with both round ball and conical HP, but round ball requires quite a bit of crimp to keep it tight on the wads (probably because I use 12-bore ball (round ball .695”). It will probably be a bit difficult to get provenance from Mr Graham Greener since the books of this period (abt 1868 or slightly later) seem to be lost. I hope I may contact you in the future for a close-up pic of the hammers for an article I’m writing on these rifles.
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Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 182
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 182 |
Nice find and with a bit of effort it will be even nicer. I would love to find a 12 bore single rifle by one of the better makers.
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