doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com speaking of light loads

Well... nobody increases velocity for velocity's sake.

A 60 fps velocity difference of a 1.46 grain #7 1/2 lead pellet at 40 yards works out to very nearly 20% difference in kinetic energy which is the whole point of the exercise.

Drag increases with the square of velocity, but so does kinetic energy.

It's good to have options and to understand the options, but I really like the way a 1330 fps load of nickel plated 5's ices a pheasant.

I never did like running.

Jones, I'm glad to hear you like 5's in the old "Super X" formula. I'd be seriously concerned if you were actually recommending that we shoot wild roosters at 40 yards with 7 1/2's!

But I do come out with significantly different numbers than you
do. Your 7 1/2, launched at 1145 fps, retains 1.03 ft-lbs of energy at 40 yards. (Most of the stuff I've read suggests that you ought to aim for a minimum of 2 ft-lbs retained energy on pheasants.) Bump that velocity up to 1200 fps . . . 1.09 ft-lbs. I'm not sure the bird is going to notice an energy increase of .06 ft-lbs.

Dave, I just noticed that I recommended those Game Bore loads to you. I mostly use the "heavier" ones: Game Bore Pure Gold 1 1/16 oz Brit 6's in a 2 1/2" paper case. That's my favorite 1st barrel load in a 12ga. Later in the season, if it's a cold and snowy hunt, I may switch to some of the RST 1 1/4 oz loads of 6's or 5's out of an SKB. Had one hunt last year where my hands were cold enough that I'm pretty sure a DT gun would have been a problem for me. Also slower getting on birds due to more layers of clothes, and roosters carrying more layers of pheasant armor (fat) than they were earlier in the season. And all of them pretty much full grown by mid-Dec or so.

Yabutt... Larry...

I was using a 60 fps speed differential at 40 yards, which Miller referenced using launch velocities of 1135 and 1330.

Your speed differential would be 1/4 of that, and 4x .06 is .24 which is (ta da) close enough to 20%.

For 7 1/2 that's actually significant.

Of course, larger pellets retain energy better which is one reason we use them.

I don't take issue with the light load crowd at all, and I use lighter loads when appropriate such as with lighter and older guns. Likewise, I try to limit range in that case. Again, I'm not out there to run.

Agree that heavy loads don't make up for lousy shooting.

Larry, you're correct. The ones I stocked up on were 1 oz of Brit 6's in a plastic hull. They seem to spec pretty close to the papers you use, and the pellet count on the one I opened was 270/oz. The patterns and recoil looked and felt the same as the 1 1/16 oz. papers you gave me to sample with maybe slightly less recoil, but not much and definitely peppy. I used them for the first 2-3 weeks last year in my way open-choked (cyl/ic) 200E and never dirtied the top barrel! They worked well, but I upsized the shot in the top barrel/tighter choke with a 1 1/8 oz. load of 6's @ 1200 fps in that light 6 1/4 pound gun.

Shotgunjones, I've had great success with the B&P MB Long Range NP5's in my heavier Beretta. Those are a 1330 fps load and that's the very top end for me.

I still have a few boxes of Eley Grand Prix paper with brit #6 from when Mr. Crocker down in TX was importing them.

No complaints. They work well in my Fox and Parker.

Only wish someone would start importing them again.

A gentleman was selling off some ammo at 16ga..com last year and of course his 16 ga. ammo went quickly. I already have too much 16 gauge hunting ammo, but I couldn't pass up a flat of these when he offered them. Anyone know when they stopped making this load?

Still quoting from the chart, energy of the #7� shot @ 1330 is 4.88 ft/lbs, @1135 3.56 ft/;bs a difference of 37%. At 60 yds they are respectively .93 ft/lbs & .80 ft/lbs a difference of 16�%
With #5's ME of the 1330 load is 10.08 ft/lbs, with the 1135 load 7.43 ft/lps for the same 37% difference. At 60 yds the faster load has dropped to 655 fps & 2.46 ft/lbs, the slower one has 605 fps & 2.09 ft/lbs a difference in energy of 17.7%. Obviously the higher speed load retains an advantage all the way, but it is nowhere near the magnitude that many believe & that the shell Makers promoted for years.

Here's the RST "Pheasant Load".. hard #5's @ 1200 fps at 35 yards. It would take a tough bird to run after getting nailed. I think this pattern would hang together out to 45 yards. 2nd barrel load.

You'd better have him near the middle of your pattern, though, and not on the edge. The edges of that pattern are pretty sketchy. That's a pretty "hot core", which is fine as long as you're dead on him. You'll be putting lot of shot in the body of a big pheasant if you've got 'im in the middle of that.

I'd have to see what several shots look like at 45 yards before pronouncing judgement on it.

SRH