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4 members (Dale May, NZHunter, SKB, 1 invisible),
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Indeed from Westley Richards thru Francotte. If we could find info on the APUN payments we'd have it(follow the money). I don't recall the A&D Body Action patent being filed in Suhl but the mechanics rode several different platforms in an attempt to settle on one while the A&D Body Action protection period played out. Charles Daly, or his agents, were the thread that binds from Scott to Tolley, Lindner and forward to the Belgian example below: http://www.hallowellco.com/charles_daly_Sidelock%20Side%20by%20Side%2020%20Gauge%20prewar.htm thru Francotte. Note, they, S,D&G, always defines the Modell by Quality Number..... Cheers, Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Ken61: What number is the above? I'm looking for examples in the 2nd series w/ Crossed Sidearms surmounted by a Crown & are devoid of the SAXONY state of origin stamp. There should have been 200 or so examples before the state of origin stamp SAXONY was applied. Cheers, Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Posts: 10,734 Likes: 181 |
Seems the transition to be compliant went thru a couple iterations: Saxony - Thüringen - Prussia.
Broadly: 215 - 350 - Saxony 350 - 500 - Thüringen 550 - Prussia.
Apparently there were a 1/2 dozen or more of Schaefer's offerings marked Thüringen. I wonder what he was up to in 1892?
Cheers,
Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Ken61: What number is the above? I'm looking for examples in the 2nd series w/ Crossed Sidearms surmounted by a Crown & are devoid of the SAXONY state of origin stamp. There should have been 200 or so examples before the state of origin stamp SAXONY was applied. Cheers, Raimey rse It's #248, so, a second series gun before the second mark was used Regards Ken
Last edited by Ken61; 01/21/17 07:25 PM.
I prefer wood to plastic, leather to nylon, waxed cotton to Gore-Tex, and split bamboo to graphite.
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Posts: 10,734 Likes: 181 |
http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20belge/artisans%20identifies%20a/a%20ancion%20dd%20et%20fils%20gb.htmWith a tip of the hat to PeteM's efforts. Just a few note on Liege tube sourcing set up by Charles Daly. Ancion & Cie.(Alfred Ancion, Dieudonné Ancion(father), Jules Ancion), Auguste Francotte, Renkin Frères, Pirlot Frères all combined to form Société des Anglais and by the time with which we are concerned, I'm sure some of the above were still picking up the pieces. Auguste Francotte is also a thread that binds or a staple when one considers @ the Daly-Suhl-Liege sourcing. At 1st, Daly was sourcing Dieudonné Ancion / Société des Anglais for in the white wares and then Val. Chr. Schilling was bringing it to final form and passed thru the Lindner shop. Next, rough pattern welded tubes were forwarded to Schilling, possibly along w/ a Gesteck, and the whole lot was assembled and passed under H.A. Lindner's quality control eye & he applied his mark noting approval. An alternative was that all was shipped to Lindner & he dispersed it to his subcontractors, but I'm not sure here. Cheers, Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Charles Daly Nr. 1581 wears the Crossed Sidearms surmounted by a Crown and Nr. 380, as well as 322, also wears the Crossed Sidearms surmounted by something, which makes me wonder if the transition from Crown to HAL was somewhat into the 2nd series? Nr. 854, has Script L above HAL and Nr. 955 has HAL.
Can't seem to quickly put my fingers on an image of an example akin to Nr. 854 w/ Script L but I have strong suspicions that Lepage - Schaefeer & Kaufman(Gustave)-(CAC touchmark) were in Daly's sourcing modell. Schaeffer & Kaufman - Liege Belgium, Hart E. Berg - agent - 281 Church Street, New York(1889 Merchant listing) Cheers, Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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I've recently received the barrels from Daly #113X, a 10ga gun that will be going into my next run. The set has only the rib lettering and the serial number, so I would put it into the first Lindner serial number sequence, yet prior to the use of the first Lindner mark. To me, the pattern looks like Bernard, and what coloring remains looks like Black & White. Sooo, possibly supporting even the early guns were Black & White. Since it's so early, I'd attribute it to Georg. Regards Ken
I prefer wood to plastic, leather to nylon, waxed cotton to Gore-Tex, and split bamboo to graphite.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Most interesting, but I'm not convinced just yet. Any initials on the underside of the tubes just forward of the flats?
Cheers,
Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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No other marks are present. I don't have the rest of the gun, but I'll ask the owner as to what marks are on the action flats. One thing interesting about this set is that it's the first set of Vintage tubes I've seen that still has some small patches of lacquer remaining. No doubt it is probably due to relacquering rather than original, but at least it shows that at some point an effort was made to preserve the coloring, either the original or a recoloring effort.
Regards Ken
Last edited by Ken61; 06/29/17 07:25 AM.
I prefer wood to plastic, leather to nylon, waxed cotton to Gore-Tex, and split bamboo to graphite.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,734 Likes: 181
Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Posts: 10,734 Likes: 181 |
Thanks Ken. From our guesstimates on dating Dalys, do you recall if Nr. 275 falls in 1878? I'll have to re-read to refresh.
Ah, wrong thread. I guess I should move the images over.
Cheers,
Raimey rse
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