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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315 |
I would not dare read the minds turn-of-the-century ad men but Miller's point re: "Bored For Nitro Powder" is well taken. Parker Lifters, 12g and esp. 10g are frequently "over-bored" by the 1890s .729" standard. Remington's ad verbiage was more precise; this from 1895. "Guaranteed..." H&A in 1903 "Guaranteed..." Folson still had the "Bored for Smokeless or Black Powder" in the c. 1915 & 1916 catalogs
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Joined: Dec 2001
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743 |
Drew; My post on the bored for nitro is primarily based on Lefever catalogs. In their catalog circa 1892 they state under "For Trap or Duck Shooting" for brass shells to use two felt wads over powder two sizes larger than bore of gun, for paper shell same except one size larger than bore. under "For field Shooting" they state for our new gun built for the use of Nitro Powders use one paste-board wad & three felt wads same size as bore. in another section of the same catalog they state that their guns made especially for Nitro Powders; "These guns we are boring smaller for the use of wads same size as bore. We find by testing these powders better results are obtained with a slightly smaller bore in order to prevent the escape of gas. In this catalog the only grade offered with steel barrels was the Optimus with Whitworth Fluid Steel @ a list price of $400.00. Whitworth was also an option listed for the Optimus grade in an 1889 price list, I do not know how much earlier it was available. Essentially it appears to me the "Bored for Nitro" has nothing to do with the actual metal the barrel was made from, but rather the size of it's bore.
Miller/TN I Didn't Say Everything I Said, Yogi Berra
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315 |
Interesting evolution by Hunter Arms. The Syracuse guns were offered in 3 frame sizes, and possibly JDW would know if the bore varied with the frame size 1886 1902 Sears, Roebuck & Co. Catalogue No. 111 "Bored For Nitro Powder" 1907 Sears, Roebuck & Co. Catalogue No. 116 "All our guns are tested with heavy loads"..."Choke bored for black or smokeless powder". Courtesy of Gary Rennles 1905 "For Nitro Powder" 1918 E.C. Simmons, St. Louis "Bored For Nitro Powder" again
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Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315 |
Some other variants 1902 J. Stevens Arms & Tool Co. "Choke Bored For Nitro Powder" 1917 Stevens Riverside No. 225 hammergun with "Nitro Steel" and No. 215 hammerless with "Rolled Steel" barrels "tested with nitro-powder before they leave the factory..." "Bored for both Black and Smokeless Powder." 1918 Field Grade Ithaca "Smokeless Powder Steel Especially Adapted for Nitro Powder"
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,746 Likes: 97
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,746 Likes: 97 |
the wealth of knowledge that can be found on this forum is remarkable...thanks to all who contribute.
keep it simple and keep it safe...
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,384 Likes: 106
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,384 Likes: 106 |
Drew, thanks for the reference to Brindle's fine series of articles. I've had them in my files for years. Some corrections made since, but mainly I think because the Internet back then was not what it is today.
I always found Brindle's articles to be interesting and a valuable contribution to what was then the collective wisdom on shotguns.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315 |
Would have been helpful if the U.S. ad men had just come out and said what they meant to say like W.W. Greener
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315 |
Keeping with the over-the-top ad verbiage theme Lefever AA "Finest A-1 Quality Silver Steel Damascus Highest Proof" courtesy of Richard Brewster
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,430 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
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This is pretty clear. Colton Manufacturing Co. in the Sears 1900 Catalog No. 110 "Shoots Any Powder...made so strong at every point that it is adapted to the use of any grade of white, black or smokeless powder." Andrew Fyrberg "Chicago Long Range Wonder" in the 1902 Sears, Roebuck & Co. Catalogue No. 111. "Our barrels are made for the highest explosive gun powders used, such as white or nitro powder...and could be used as safely as the regular black powder."
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 313
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 313 |
Drew, thank you for all the hard work and dedication you put into this research!! Many, many times I turn to your articles for answers to many questions I, and others have regarding barrel steel. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!
Mike Koneski MOLON LABE
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