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Forums10
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Most Online1,344 Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,278 Likes: 11
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,278 Likes: 11 |
According to Don Zutz, the purpose of a beaver tail forend is compatibility with a pistol grip and keep the hands in alignment. Just one of many stupid things that Zutz wrote. A classic purveyor of misconceptions. How he ever came to be a "recognized authority" is one of the mysteries of the cosmos. And Rocketman - once the gun is mounted the grip hand carries no weight at all. If you mount a gun and let go with the grip hand you will see - no change in the weight in the other hand. The grip hand has a number of duties but carrying any weight ain't one of 'em. And shooting styles change as biometric/ergonomic data is incorporated into sports. You can shoot any way you like, or you can use your brain first and optimize that activity. You chose. have another day Dr.WtS
Last edited by Wonko the Sane; 12/29/15 02:17 PM.
Dr.WtS Mysteries of the Cosmos Unlocked available by subscription
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,435 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,435 Likes: 1 |
I'm that in actuality, all this has little to do with improved function and nearly all to do with fashion. When your hero shows up at the club with a funky new forearm and then shoots well with it, you and all your buddies want one just like it because #1 it looks cool, #2 you attribute your hero's outstanding performance to his new forearm, trigger, shooting gloves, far-out colored shooting glasses, bore cleaner, etc., etc., etc..
Those old guys reaching way out on the barrels remind me of 3-gun shooters with their carbines these days. They use that not because it is combat tested but because guys like Costa, Haley and others use it in their videos and courses. It's just fashion.
Fashion is human nature and has been around forever. Fashions come and go. Today I noted a painting of the skipper of the USS Constitution from 1812 and he was sporting a faux-hawk hair style! And who would have ever thought that, in some circles, it would be fashion correct the wear your pants below you buttocks? To think that there is actually a method to this minor madness regarding shotgunning is prolly really stretching it boys.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,418 Likes: 2
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,418 Likes: 2 |
a lot like those ridiculous 32in small bores.....just a fashion statement.....go back 40/50years and 25/26in barrels were in fashion....go back 100 years and SxSs were in fashion..but those pump guns were coming on strong..... now shoot either in any clay game and your an old fud.....
gunut
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,087 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,087 Likes: 1 |
I think it was something new to sell more stuff. Same with the vent rib. No real function beyond enhancing the bottom line.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,894 Likes: 110
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,894 Likes: 110 |
A hundred fifteen years ago the doubles still ruled as this picture from the 1901 Grand American Handicap that shows the 22 shooters that went 25 straight -- Only Ansley H. Fox holding a Winchester pump. A similar picture from 100 years ago would likely show at least half the shooters with repeaters.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,435 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,435 Likes: 1 |
a lot like those ridiculous 32in small bores.....just a fashion statement.....go back 40/50years and 25/26in barrels were in fashion....go back 100 years and SxSs were in fashion..but those pump guns were coming on strong..... now shoot either in any clay game and your an old fud..... Or maybe you are the nuevo cutting edge.......
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Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 547
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 547 |
no ones smiling!
some things never change! :>
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,427 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,427 Likes: 315 |
Sorry guys. Still cleaning up after returning from the Canelo Hills area. Met up with Chuck H., his BIL, and Bill Henry; plenty of dog power with Sky, Chick and Dirk who thought Sky was really hot and delusionally, at age 10, thought he could race through the countryside with her. He can hardly walk now. 31 and snowing over the Santa Ritas as I drove up 83 toward Sonoita, and the snow hit us as we started. An incredible sunrise through the clouds over the Mustang Mountains, and snow on Mt. Wrightson to the west. First re: Capt. Money. I think that image was from a Peters promo or ad dated 1914, but agree the picture was taken much earlier. I do think it's the Capt. based on his Parker, body habitus, likely mustache, and esp. the eyes. Second: target gun barrel length. Until about 1900, most competitors used 30" barrels. After Fred Gilbert won the 1st DuPont Grand Smokeless Championship Handicap Live-bird Tournament with a Smith, orders poured in with the "Fred Gilbert Specifications": drop at comb of 1 3/8 inches; at the heel, 2 inches; length from trigger to heel, 14 1/4 inches; trigger to toe 14 1/2 inches; and trigger to center of butt 14 inches; with a full pistol grip and 30-inch full choke barrels. Gilbert used his Smith in the 1899 GAH then switched to a Parker. Order Book No. 41 records BH SN 83855 placed into stock in January, 1896 consigned to Fred Gilbert. The stock book lists a D5 hammerless, 0 extras, straight stock,12 gauge, 30" barrels. Toward the end of 1901, Gilbert received his new Parker DH SN 103649; no dolls head, no ejectors, 32" barrels. As Researcher observed, the transition to single barrel repeating shotguns was starting after introduction of the Winchester 1897, used by the great J.A.R. Elliott, and with a 30" barrel the sighting plane was more like 32". 1914 GAH. The resolution is not adequate to ID many of the guns, but clearly a bunch of repeaters
Last edited by Drew Hause; 12/29/15 07:48 PM. Reason: 1914 image added
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,427 Likes: 315
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,427 Likes: 315 |
Researcher: I'd like to add that 1901 image here with your permission. What was the source? https://docs.google.com/document/d/1I_5GfGqfidbrfhpwzMvsccjDxjCd39M6nERp99wVEBQ/preview 1901 GAH at Live Birds April 1 & 2, Interstate Park, New York http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/SportingLife/1901/VOL_37_NO_03/SL3703012.pdfWon by E. C. Griffith (Parker), of Pascoag, R. I. He killed 25 straight in the race and finished 18 more in the tie, shooting out twenty one other men who tied him. 2nd - J.L.D. Morrison (Winchester), 3rd - R.R. Bennett (Parker), 4th - J.B. Barto (Parker), 5th - Chris Gottlieb (Smith) Shooters were handicapped from 25 to 33 yards: W. R. Crosby, J.A.R. Elliott and Fred Gilbert shot from 32 yards. Thomas A. Marshall & Jack Fanning at 31 yds. E.D. Fulford & Rolla Heikes at 30yds. Charley “Sparrow” Young at 29 yds. http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/SportingLife/1901/VOL_37_NO_04/SL3704018.pdfhttp://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/SportingLife/1901/VOL_37_NO_04/SL3704019.pdfGuns: Parker – 85, Smith - 34. Francotte - 21, Winchester - 11, Remington - 7. Scott - 6, Daly – 6, Cashmore – 5, Greener – 5, Lefever – 4, W. Richards - 3, Purdey - 2, Saxton, Clabrough, Cogswell, Churchill, James, Lang, Baltimore, Ithaca, Young, Reilly, Boss - 1 each. http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/SportingLife/1901/VOL_37_NO_07/SL3707024.pdf http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/SportingLife/1901/VOL_37_NO_04/SL3704021.pdfResponse by the New York Times April 2, 1901 ”Hundreds of Pigeons Killed to Make Sport” http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9F02E3DB1E38E733A25751C0A9629C946097D6CF
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Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 547
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 547 |
i thank all of you for your contributions.
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