doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Thinking about getting a C&R..

I never had a BATF check my C&R stuff, but it was all in order anyways. I never had them check me when I had a 01 years earlier but knew others who did get checked. My only issue was with LOE who was out of control. Looking back on it I should have let him arrest me. That lawsuit would have paid for several years of gun purchases and ammo.

Our little town has deep pockets when it comes to settling out of court I have been told. That was the apparent reason the Town Lawyer had counseled both the LEO and elected officials about exceeding his powers. They had quietly settled another issue and paid a hefty settlement claim. I think the reason the Mayor came over was to prevent another problem for the town. By the way the LEO is now retired I am told.

Unless you have a jerk LEO to deal with, then get a C&R if you want. Do be aware that you may need to keep track of purchases and potential sales taxes. Neighbor just had to pay sales taxes on pens he was making and selling. Cost him several hundred dollars in the end. There is no free lunch where governments are concerned with taxes, fees and permits.

In my most recent transaction I had to change FFLs because my regular FFL had taken quite ill. The "new" FFL is someone I'm well acquainted with. He would not give me a copy of his FFL to send to the seller. We talked about it for a while. He advised his reason was that there have been reports of people getting a blue signature FFL from a legit FFL, then going to a seller with that document after modifying it (probably involving a scanner or color copier) to change the address on the document to the buyer's - not the FFL's - address. The shipment then goes direct to the buyer's address, the FFL never sees the gun, and away we go. If the FFL ever asks the buyer, he tells the FFL the deal fell through (and can even give back the blue signature document, if needed).

My "new" FFL is a retired LEO and still has good contacts in that community. I suspect (true or not) the stories about fraudulent modifications of FFL document are being spread by ATF, but it doesn't really matter so long as the stories are out there.

That, and the seller in my latest transaction was in Connecticut. He related how all the FFLs/dealers there are really skittish still between the post Newtown crackdown and CT law enforcement and pols looking for any excuse.

It's a business decision that all these FFL have to make�what gets me is the ones that act like they are doing you a big favor while charging you $50-$75�I've found a dealer that charges $20 and posts the FFL license on their website for easy access by the seller - they get all my business now, even though I have to drive an hour to get there

When handing out a FFL-most now go email, I write
FOR TRANSFER ONLY some add "No Face to Face" as well.

All dealer FFL numbers and address's are online,easy enough for a crook to make up a fake one,they don't need yours.

Dave, that is precisely the same story the two gunshop managers gave me earlier this week. Wonder why the gun grabbers haven't spread this all over the news if it is true? They were also told that if their FFL were involved in a situation like that, it would be immediately revoked and they'd be out of business...Geo

Why do you need a copy,have him email the seller his FFL ?
The signed in blue ink requirement is long gone with the ok of email as I understand it

I would say 90% of gun sales are through emailed FFL's to the seller,then he puts his hard copy (again with FOR TRANSFER ONLY) on it in the box with the gun.
You should also check the FFL number (not 03's thou,) on ezcheck ,his addy should be the same.

It's their license so every dealer needs to do what they feel comfortable with, as they interpret the ATF regulations. If they choose not to deal with a C&R because they view it as risky or not in their business interests then that's their choice. the same with accepting shipments from non-FFLs, that's their choice. I choose who I do business with based on my interests and my understanding of ATF regulations. if I sell a gun and the buyer chooses to use a dealer who will not accept a legal shipment from me, a non-license holder, I advise the buyer to either locate another FFL who will or send me an additional $50. I have found a dealer who charges a reasonable fee for a transfer and makes it easy for me to get to the seller the needed information to efficiently and legally complete the transaction. So it obviously doesn't have to be as difficult as some make it but as I started with, it's up to the dealer. we get to choose the dealers with which we do business

Dave, that is precisely the same story the two gunshop managers gave me earlier this week. Wonder why the gun grabbers haven't spread this all over the news if it is true? They were also told that if their FFL were involved in a situation like that, it would be immediately revoked and they'd be out of business...Geo [/quote]

I suspect there are two good (and a bunch more not so good) explanations.

1. The story is just another one of those stories that gets spread, true or not, and keeps people scared. Used to be you'd plunk your money order, 2 copies of a bill of sale (one for buyer, one for seller), the blue-signature FFL and a cover letter ("make sure you send it to the FFL!") into an envelope, drop it into the mail to the seller and in a week or so get a call from your FFL to come in and pick up your new thing.
Given that the feds have been running a 100% mail cover (tracking all mail) for at least 14-15 years, the scam described in the story told me only works if they don't care enough to chase down the miscreants.

2. The grabbers are too busy chasing what they're now calling "ghost guns", i.e., stuff people make at home. So much so%2

That's bullshit. All the shipping FFL has to do is run a BATF "FFL EZ Check" and verify the shipping address of the FFL. If the copy sent has been altered the shipping FFL can see it instantly and report it to the BATFE. I just checked my FFL and it came back with his correct shipping address - since I was already sitting at the computer it took less than 30 seconds to Google the BATFE "FFL EZ Check" and look up the information. This is not available for C&R licenses - and therefore is probably the reason that some FFL's won't ship to C&R licensees.

I don't buy large numbers of guns across state lines but when I do it's frequently "spur of the moment" so my FFL gives me a scan of his current FFL to keep on my computer to send when the urge arises. I've never had a problem and he charges a $25 transfer fee, which is reasonable for the amount of time that it takes to do the transfer - and it's quicker than most since both my wife and I have concealed weapons permits and don't require a NICS background check. His cooperation has been handy because the last firearm that I bought was a handgun that arrived 5 days after I FedExed the funds.

I don't do business with anyone who bullshits me.

Well, he's the FFL, he can believe what he wants and it's his license and his fear of The Man. My "old" FFL used to give me a copy of his that I could use like you say you do, and it was surely handy to have. But he took ill and the "new" FFL does his business his way.