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Joined: Jan 2015
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Boxlock
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Boxlock

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I need some help from those experienced with drillings and European cartridges. Many years ago I bought a 9.3 X 74 R double rifle over a 16 gauge LeHanne drilling from Griffith and Howe, in New York. I have fired hundreds of 9.3 X 74 R rounds through it, and even reloaded cartridges for it, all with pretty good accuracy, and devastating effects on game. I decided to sell the drilling, and was surprised when Albright's Gun Shop in Easton found the barrel flats marked 8.7mm X 75 mm. My research have shown a 9.3mm X 75mm cartridge was made which was different from the 9.3mm X74 mm R, and that it was not unusual pre-WW II to measure a bullet diameter by the distance from land to land instead of groove to groove. We are going to take a chamber casting and a barrel slug to get the exact dimensions of the cartridge for which this drilling was chambered. Questions: 1) If this drilling was chambered for the unusual 9.3mm X 75mm instead of the typical 9.3X 74 R, is it safe to fire it with the 9.3 mm X 74 mm R cartridge (sort of like fire-forming "improved" cartridges), or have I been lucky for the last 30 years? 2)Is the 8.7 designation a pre-WW II notation for land diameter, or have I been lucky squeezing a 9.3 bullet down a 8.7 mm barrel?

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The dims will shed more light. It could be a T&S or Sauer variant. Ford had a similar experience & I'm sure will chime in on the thread.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

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Sharps4590(I think)has a 9.3x75R,which if I recall correctly has a head diameter similar to 9.3x72R. If this is correct, a 9,3x74R cartridge will not fit into an original 9.3x75R chamber.Assuming this to be the case, if 9.3x74R ammo has been used in it;it must have been rechambered.If it has been rechambered,the appropriate answer would be load for it using 9.3x74R cases, but bullets appropriate for the barrel at pressures for 9,3x75R, or less.Rechanbering would have removed some metal from the chamber wall.For a time,9.3x72R and similar brass was hard to find and 9,3x74R ammo was somewhat avaliable.This resulted in some guns, unfortunately, being rechambered from 9.3x72R and similar cartridges to 9.3x74R.If Vic chimes in and his 9.3x75R has a head dia.similar to the 9.3x74R,the above opinion is incorrect.Often,9.3 barrels will be marked with 8.7mm groove dia(also 8.8,etc.),so this doesn't indicate a problem.To complicate matters further,the 75mm just means it would accept a 75mm long case,not that it was the name of the cartridge.To help in determining the proper cartridge, it would be helpful to know if the rifle prints both barrels to the same point of impact with 9.3x74R ammo.

Mike

Last edited by Der Ami; 01/21/15 01:20 PM.
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I have a 9.3x75 T&S and the 9.3x74R will not chamber in it. The 9.3x72 is not happy out of it either but it will shoot. I have not had time to work on loads or brass with my latest "health project of the month' going on this year.


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Ben,
Did I get you and Vic mixed up, or do both of you have a 9.3x75?
Mike

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No, you didn't get us mixed up Mike. I didn't know there was another 9.3 X 75R in the country. You and dr are correct, the X74R will not chamber in the X75R as the head diameter is bigger I believe. Yes, that's right, I just miced two cases. My X75R head is .427 and the X74R is .462. I made my X75R cases from pricey 9.3 X 82R cases. That's the one I had to get a Lee 38-55 die, grind out the threads in the sizing die for the decapping pin and use that to swage the body down just a bit so it would chamber. I had to anneal the case body also to prevent longitudinal case splits. I don't recall my bore/land dimensions offhand but I shoot .358 unaltered bullets in it with excellent results. I want to say the groove dia. is .359-.360. Mine is also a T&S and from what Axel and I discussed the cartridge was proprietary to T&S. I'm not aware of any other maker chambering this T&S cartridge and it seems, from what Axel thinks, that it was something of a transitional cartridge between black powder and smokeless with evidently a very short commercial life. What threw the kinks in my work with the X75R was that it was stamped "X74 1/2" and the obvious difference in head size from the chamber cast to the 9.3 X 74R case. Axel identified the cartridge for me. I understand 'Cartridges of the World' published my load data for the 9.3 X 75R in the new, 17th edition.

I'm completely ignorant of LeHanne. This is merely my thought; if Doc's drilling was made post WWI it seems unlikely it was originally chambered for the 9.3 X 75R Nimrod cartridge. However...even for no longer than I've been seriously fooling with German drillings and the like I've learned there are no such words as 'never' and 'always'.

Last edited by sharps4590; 01/28/15 08:23 AM.

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