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Quote:
:Changing norms in our society dictated the reversal of sodomy laws and we opened the door to the gay revolution. Like it or not we have it now...Geo"

This law change does NOT change the Bible which maintains homosexuality is an abomination.
I and I suspect ALL practicing Christians subscribe to this belief.
So What's next? Change the laws about bestiality? Change the laws to permit "Mercy" killings. You are entitled to your own "personal values" and I have told the Gays I know in the past that they are entitled to their "personal values" as well and I could care less what the do in private. However when what they do is made public and they attempt to advocate their practices my stance would dramatically change.
This is just ONE more issue where the Country is deeply divided and I don't expect there will be any changes in these major rifts in the short term if ever.
Jim

Additionally: I don't have any problems talking about my personal values. I was raised to be my own man and to develop a spine and to stand up for what I believe in. If this offends anyone here or anywhere else that's just too damn bad!
Phil R. didn't have to state what he stated. He could have danced around just like the majority of spineless pansy's do all the time. If I was spineless I'd have probably developed a career reporting the "news" on MSNBC!

Yes Jim we've all noticed that you stand up for what You believe in and that you do not appreciate anyone who holds any different opinion. You do not have to agree with me and I do not have to agree with you. I do not condone homosexuality but I'll stand with what I posted...Geo

You're wrong Geo:
I have no problem what-so-ever with opposing views if you can back them up with facts. I have a real problem with Libtards like King Brown who make statements they can't support with facts then obfuscate or try to take the discussion in a different direction.
I can and will back up with facts anything I state on this forum. If you don't condone homosexuality as Phil R clearly doesn't then what's wrong with standing up and saying just that?

The only reason we have a Communist idiot occupying the White House is the refusal of most to stand up and state the truth about this liar and cheat.
Here you want some Obama facts(accomplishments) Many of which would probably have gotten a White Conservative impeached. I for one am sick and disgusted with those who just stand by and watch this Country being destroyed by a combination of communism and lack of moral values.
Your "not signing petitions" is tacit approval of GLAAD and all it stands for. Complacency like yours has resulted in the mess we have today.


He has an impressive list of accomplishments:
First President to apply for college aid as a foreign student, then deny he was a foreigner.
First President to have a social security number from a state he has never lived in.
First President to preside over a cut to the credit-rating of the United States.
First President to be held in contempt of court for illegally obstructing oil drilling in the Gulf of Mexico.
First President to require all Americans to purchase a product from a third party.
First President to spend a trillion dollars on �shovel-ready� jobs when there was no such thing as �shovel-ready� jobs.
First President to abrogate bankruptcy law to turn over control of companies to his union supporters.
First President to by-pass Congress and implement the Dream Act through executive fiat.
First President to order a secret amnesty program that stopped the deportation of illegal immigrants across the U.S. , including those with criminal convictions.
First President to demand a company (BP after the oil spill) hand-over $20 billion to one of his political appointees.
First President to tell a CEO of a major corporation (Chrysler) to resign.
First President to terminate America�s ability to put a man in space.
First President to cancel the National Day of Prayer and to say that America is no longer a Christian nation.
First President to arbitrarily declare an existing law unconstitutional and refuse to enforce it.
First President to threaten insurance companies if they publicly spoke-out on the reasons for their rate increases.
First President to tell a major manufacturing company in which state it is allowed to locate a factory.
First President to file lawsuits against the states he swore an oath to protect (AZ, WI, OH, IN (and others)).
First President to withdraw an existing coal permit that had been properly issued years ago.
First President to actively try to bankrupt an American industry (coal).
First President to fire an inspector general of Ameri-Corps for catching one of his friends in a corruption case.
First President to appoint 45 czars to replace elected officials in his office.
First President to surround himself with radical left wing anarchists. (How quickly we forget Alger Hiss, et al.... Oh, he was a commie, not an anarchist? What difference, at this point, does it make? Besides, who ever heard of an anarchist who wanted to be coddled by the nanny state cradle to grave?)
First President to golf 73 separate times in his first two and a half years in office, 102 to date. (This must have been going around for a while. Last I heard, it was over 150 times, and that was some time back.)
First President to hide his medical, educational and travel records.
First President to win a Nobel Peace Prize for doing NOTHING to earn it.
First President to go on multiple global �apology tours� and concurrent �insult our friends� tours.
First President to go on 17 lavish vacations, including date nights and Wednesday evening White House parties for his friends paid for by the taxpayers.
First President to have 22 personal servants (taxpayer funded) for his wife.
***

Jim's entitled to his facts; none should take them away from him. Mandela was a Communist. South Africa is a Communist state. It's committing genocide against whites. Obama is a Communist. He is also an idiot. He did NOTHING to earn the Nobel Prize. .Jim has "a real problem with Libtards like King Brown who make statements they can't support with facts. . ."

Ah, Jim, I love you! Doesn't matter what you say. You sail close to the wind on fair speech. You're not mean. You treat the Bible and the First and Second Amendments as articles of faith, literally. Eminent theologians and jurists interpret them differently in different circumstances. But all well's even there because Christians are called to be faithful whatever the consequences!

What on earth has Obama got to do with Phil Robertson's quotes in GQ and his problems with A&E, Jim? I have to admit I have no idea what GLAAD is, but if you say I'm tacitly or otherwise approving of whatever it is I expect you'd be wrong about that too.

I think (that's an opinion) that Phil was wrong to pass judgment on homosexuals and others that they were going to Hell and leaving out the part about redemption. How's he know?

That may be the belief of his denomination (Church of Christ), but it is not my belief. Hard to argue religious matters because it's all based in Faith...Geo

Geo.,

Phil's statement is not an Old Testament "opinion" only. I don't see how the following New Testament scripture can be interpreted any other way.

I Cor. 6:9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. NKJV

God's grace is there for all who will accept His cross for themselves and walk in His ways. But His saving grace does not extend to those who willfully disobey his statutes and commandments. Among those things He says is sin are those in the above verse written by Paul to the Corinthians. Notice there are others there, besides homosexuality, but 4 of the 7 mentioned there are sexual sins. It seems the Corinthians had a special tendency toward those.

I think where we often are guilty of hypocrisy is our propensity to point a bony finger at homosexuals, condemning their sins, and overlook our own sins. Though God especially called homosexuality an abomination, He never meant that other sins were less serious. All sin separates us from Him, and His saving grace only comes through forgiveness, and forgiveness only comes through repentance, actively denouncing and turning away from those sins in our lives.

Christ is our Redeemer, absolutely, and redemption can come only through Him. But, the kicker is that until we turn from our sins and ask forgiveness, that grace and redemption does not include us. The idea that Christ died for all, and that God is a loving God that would never condemn anyone to hell, including practicing homosexuals (and thieves, idolaters, extortioners, and adulterers) is a lie promoted by the Enemy to salve man's conscience.

I agree with Phil. If you believe the Holy Bible is the inspired word of God, that it is inerrant, and does not contradict itself, you must believe that practicing homosexuals are bound for a terrible eternity away from the presence of God, in hell. However, as long as there is life in a body there is hope for conviction of sin, repentance, and reconciliation. But, when the body and soul separate, at death, it is too late. There is no changing the soul's destination at that point. God doesn't change to suit the times. James 1:17 ...... "with whom (the Father) there is no variation or shadow of turning".NKJV The God who destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah is the same God we serve today, and the same one we will stand before to give account of the deeds of this life.

Sobering thought.

All my best, SRH

Stan,
I appreciate your well thought out and Biblical post. I agree that the Bible comes down hard on sin, as it should if it's the Word, but I still believe that up until that last moment of life all sin may be washed away in the blood of the Lamb. Sodomy although particularly odious and un-sanitary is no exception.

What about the dietary strictures? If God is bound by the pronouncements of those who wrote down the Old Testament and may not change with the experience of His people, is my particular love of good bacon a sin? Not in my mind; HE is with us now and He knows that all that was ascribed to having been His word is His to change.

Old Phil is a born again sinner according to his own book. Why would he think that his redemption is unique? I don't think he really does!...Geo

Spoken and posted like a true agnostic King I would have expected nothing less from you.
Also of course posted like a true Libtard who can't refute anything I or anyone else posts as facts.
Crawl back into you dream world while you still can.

Oh and BTW: Please note that there has been NO ATTEMPT to refute what I posted above about Obama by King Brown and any of his minions.

Sitting here in the dark with my iPad. In the middle of an ice storm and the power is out. I expect it will be for a while.

I found your post quite interesting Stan. I'm curious, and I'm really not trying to start something, just explore it, but as you noted, four of the seven sins mentioned are of a sexual nature. What is with the focus on sex?