doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Universal Firearms Model 2035

I picked up an Italian O/U at a pawn shop for $300. It's double triggered extractor with a Kirsten lock up. Proofed in 69 From what I can tell from the internet $300 seems about the going price. Seems a nice gun for the money. I can't help but wonder what's wrong with it. Anybody here able to tell me any thing? I bought it for a spit on the floor hunting shooter. Seems a nicer gun then an 870.

Universal Firearms Corp. Hileah Fla.

Universal imported guns from Italy and Russia. They stopped about 1982.

Pete

Would you know who made the gun?

Zero brand recognition value?

some from spain, as well.

If it came out of Russia, it was most likely Baikal. The were a lot of small Italian shops around at the time, many did not survive. Wish I could be of more help.

Pete

As I said before, Baikal isn't a maker, it's a brand.

Anyway, there weren't any Russian o/u's with Koersten lockup.

Pooch, Sabatti or Zoli would be maybe the most likely possibilities of relatively well-known Italian makers. Any maker's mark in evidence other than standard Italian proofmarks? I picked up a 20ga Italian OU made for Sears a number of years ago. Made by Zoli.

I owned a Universal Over Wing 20 Ga O/U in the mid seventies. Purchased from K-mart for $179.00 on a close out. It was Spanish made. Never had any issues with it other than it was stocked like a trap gun and wasn't to useful for chasing Okie Bobwhites.

Hey Tulsa, I'm a Will Rogers grad.

I've found no clues at this point. My guess is Zoli. It's a surprisingly well made gun with all sorts of what I believe to be acid engraving. But I have found that when something appears to be too good to be true. It usually is.

Pictures of your proofmarks would be of assistance

Jeez pooch, I didn't think I'd have to post the above photo for you!

Steve

I'm an old river rat myself. (Daniel Webster)

One thing in common..... we couldn't ever brag about our Football Teams

We were state Champions in Football and every other sport. 1956

I put money down to hold it I have yet to retrieve the gun. picture will come later.

It could be Angelo Zoli, but Investarm, Fausti, Marocchi, Rizzini (inexpensive mass produced one),......are also possibilities. In bargain O/U category I would limit myself to: BC Miroku, Sakaba, Savage 300 series (Finnish Valmets), and made for Sears Olin Kodensha guns (like Ted Williams 400).

Good advice as I am familiar with the guns recommended, but I'm a sucker for that Italian low profile.

Hi Pooch. I have one of these guns. My father gave it to me for my 18th B-Day back in 1978. Mine is a very nice looking gun with straight grained walnut stock, chrome lined bores, DT's, and fairly tight chokes. Unfortunately it also came with a tendancy to slam fire. It got me kicked out of a goose blind once...Anyhow, I took it to New England Custom Guns in Claremont NH for them to fix the slam fire thing. Took 2 trips. I asked them who they think made it and they told me they thought it was a Franchi.

Mergus

Here's the gun.





I think it's pretty, but the proof will be in the shooting. If it shoots I'm going to have the bottom barrel opened to skeet or Cyl Imp. I want to use it for a bird gun. I don't mind a second barrel being tight cause by the time I quit cussing myself for missing the birds are a ways down line.

Yep, that's it. I really like the way mine handles, especially compared to my Citori. It has to be a pound lighter.

Mergus

Action looks VERY much like an Antonio Zoli I had in the 1970s, a nice field grade gun.

I remember getting a double on chukars with it in the canyon of Asotin Creek, WA one fine morning. And a "single" on a diamondback!

There were also some 'lesser' Rizinni made guns along those same exact lines, but w.dif engraving and the actions finished in the 'light', for lack of a better expression. It was not a French gray and they were not polished either. I had one for a while, TTBLNE. Horrible triggers, but otherwise not a bad gun at all from a form and function perspective. If you look long and hard & use a good glass and strong light there is likely a maker's mark present. I almost think on some of those guns it was intentionally lightly stamped; it was so on mine, but who knows? Had the triggers in the one I had been better, I would have kept it, but I wasn't in the mood at the time to put much money in it and traded it away on a gun I was much more interested in owning & shooting. Triggers aside, it was actually a well enough made and good pointing 20ga. gun w/well regulated bbls. & light enough to lug about all day too. I actually quite liked it, but those triggers ultimately were the deal breaker for me and off it went. I'd given serious thot to having K. Merrington fix them or rebuild from scratch as necessary, but such undertakings have a way of easily becoming boat like and so I restrained myself, that time;-) Still, it could have been a very nice sow's ear.

I finally picked up my gun and after cleaning darned if it isn't a pretty decent looking gun. Actually it's a model 2036 Not an English Best but neither is it an Italian worst. One of the barrels is marked kgi 400. I think that is a Zoli model number. So my guess it's a Zoli. I'm about to quit beating my brains out on the Army&Navy project and use this darned thing instead to annoy winged creatures. I don�t know where I could get as nice a gun else where for $300. Though I have heard the Beretta BLs go for a low figure. I don�t know what my future status on this august forum will be now that I have tainted myself as a shooter of cheap Italian O/U shotguns. Perhaps if I call it a Zoltetti 12 bore

You won't find ANY Beretta O/U for $300, unless they've been sleeping with the fishes for a long while, and have the rust to prove it.

You will find that your Zoli KICKS if you try 3" 20s in it. Mine would kill pheasants fine with 1 oz. loads, so I quit with the magnums.

This one is a 12 ga er bore and it's only chambered for 2 3/4. I lean toward lighter loads as only wish to kill the birds in the air. I plan to process them on the ground. There is a shell call the Texas dove load, it could also called the low flying airplane load as it contains enough powder and shot for a Jihad. I�ve asked why people buy these loads and am told they are the only load that will cycle in their gun and all they get with lighter loads is feathers. I have to bite my tongue to not tell them to clean their gun and quit shooting the birds in the butt.

Looks exactly like the Zoli (made for Sears) I bought several years back.

Isn't "cycle" a dirty (half-ass pun intended) word in these parts? Except when applied to Indians and Nortons, of course.

Ok, Pooch, pictures of the proofmarks and other markings
would help to establish a maker.

Mike

Every thing is pretty straight forward; Italian stuff is not that complicated. Nitro proofs, date, chamber length, inspectors ititials. The one number that didn't seem to belong was kgi 400 stamp and I think that is a Zoli model designation.

I believe the Italian proof houses also stamp the barrel weight in kilograms; i.e., "KG 1400", which indicates a barrel set weight of 3.08 lbs. (2.2 lbs. X 1.4 kilograms) at proof.

Dang!!! So much for the Zoli idea.

I think Nick Hahn, in a DGJ article on Italian OU's, referred to that as a "proprietary" (might not be the word he used) Italian action. Quite a few Italian OU's built using that somewhat modified Kersten system.

If it's a Zoli, there should be a bow and arrow proofmark somewhere.

I've been looking for that bow and arrow and there is a smear of mark that might be on but my eyes are getting even weaker then my brain and as of yet have not brought to bear needed tools to read the bloody thing. The ksi 400 does indeed look more like an inspectors mark then one of a manufacturer and am a bit embarrassed at my not being able to discern the obvious answer. Thank God for a place we can go where, in the matter of firearms at least, wisdom regularly trumps ignorance.

With bright light and loupe I have searched and found nothing. Just an Italian orphan, but if it shoots as well as it swings it has found a home.

I can't find any hint of a makers mark on mine either. If the guys at NECG can't tell me who made it, I don't feel so blind not being able to find a maker's mark.

Mergus