doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Telltale signs of redone case colors

I'm curious, has anyone here had a receiver re-case colored by a reputable source and experienced warping issues or some other issues ? I've see many threads here about case coloring and some seem obviously very against it and others for it. I've had 5 guns re-cased by John Gillette at Classic Guns and haven't had a single issue with any of them.

Have I been playing with fire and my luck will run out eventually or are issues with re-case coloring few and far between ?

Vince

Yes Drew, those are the rings I was referring to. Guess my theory was 'all wet' that this was a telltale sign of recolor as evidence by the new L. C. Smith colors you showed. I think Joe Wood's theory and mention of plugging the pin holes prior to the case color process sure sounds like a way to prevent these rings to me. If i was a gambler I'd be tempted to bet thats how it's done to prevent this ring phenomenon. Thx a lot guys. Your posts made a lot of sense !

Look for pits or corrosion. If the colour hardening is on top of it - well, there you go!

Sometimes you can just tell. Overall condition of the gun compared with condition of colours on locks and action etc.

fortunately, it has been my observation that the instances of problems caused by receiver reheat treating has been significantly reduced in recent years...most likely due to the amateurs realizing the error or their ways...

meantime, there is the cost vs resale value to consider...

You saying you've extinguished your coloring torch ?

From the master of acetylene torch color case...

We have a clear admission.

That "value" trumps "error."

When you were selling all of those grotesque acetylene torch polka dot colored guns, did viewing them ever trigger L.S.D. flashbacks in any of the buyers?

Buzz:

It is called ghosting. I have re-cased receivers both ways. To reduce ghosting, pinning and using old screws and pins during your blocking as you fixture and pack the crucible.

All double guns new and re-cased are cased with the hinge pin in place and if you look carefully at all the pictures posted here and above or anywhere, original and re-cased, there is no ghosting around the hinge pins. This pretty much answers your original question.

Most of us doing case colors try to achieve as near the original "factory" case colors as possible. Many factories "did not" pin or screw the holes as it was time consuming and sometimes pin removal was a pain after heat treating. After all, they were in business to make money. But even with the same manufacturer, many times variations occur, in other words sometimes they appear to have been pinned and sometimes not. CCH is like a snow flake, no two are the same.

A well done re-case by a competent tradesman or shop on a complete restoration, where the entire gun starts out fresh again, is near impossible to distinguish from an original factory color case hardening procedure.

But there are so many "gaudy" over the top re-case jobs out there with all the wrong parts cased that were actually blued, that it is usually quite easy to spot a re-case. Like the gaudy one pictured above from a well known shop where the forend iron is cased and should not be as it is an "extractor" gun and L.C. only cased forend irons on "ejector" guns. Then there are the ones with bone that should be cyanide and vise verse. It is very much like many of the Field Grade and other grade guns out there that have been re-stocked with XXX wood or greater which really look out of place, it's the same with case colors, too much and it becomes a circus piece. To me these "out of place" upgrades look like white wall tires on a Ferrari.

With the proper amount of homework on exactly what a specific gun looked like as it left the factory, most 'good' case color tradesman can duplicate very closely the original look desired.

Some examples of guns that I have done with ghosting for the factory original look and no ghosting for the same original factory look where it applies after proper home work and research:







1892 Marlin no ghosting.....


Top L.C. Smith 20 no ghosting.....

Hi all.
Just a few things I do know about that �ALL MUCK AND MAGIC� Vintage artisan Brit colour case hardening treatment.
The range of colours can in part be changed a small amount by adding other items to the Charcoal /Bone mix such as charred leather, Ivory scrap, ground up animal teeth
By adding varying amounts of Salt Peter (Potassium Nitrate) to the quenching water.
Also how much Air disturbance you introduce in to the quenching water.
Making a �Chill,� an older term for a piece of metal added to another piece of metal to affect its rate of cooling in a semi controlled way. Just to deviate from the gun subject a little the positioning in the foundry of bearing mould chills was a closely guarded secret in times past especially when it came to casting and supplying the Bronze �Mill Stand Brasses� for rolling mills. By not getting the chills correct the life of a heavy Mill stand bearing could be drastically reduced. This secrecy also stopped other bearing manufacturers from trying to poach your customer.
To stop colour changing �ringing� by holes the fitting of a clay plug or a pin to stop the water from entering this then prevents a different rate of temperature change by the hole.
I do bereave that colour case hardening is an art form and not just an industrial process by virtue of the number of times a man does it and the ways he experiments to get a finish particular to him.

PA24, you do beautiful work!