doublegunshop.com - home Forums THE MARTIN/ZIMMERMAN TRAGEDY

well, the trial is over and the verdict is in. is now the appropriate time to make comment?

No winner in this one. If Zimmerman thought blacks were suspicious before he is going to really be a nervous wreck now.

There have always been risks in getting into a street fight under any circumstances. All states now have concealed carry laws. Most have "stand your ground" laws. The risks are even greater now than they were ten years ago.

I didn't understand why Zimmerman waived his right to go before a judge in a self-defense hearing. Had he been successful in that hearing he would have been immune from prosecution for the shooting.

I wonder if the US Justice Department is going to file some kind of charges against Zimmerman, accusing him of violating Martin's civil rights or of committing a hate crime.

The steady flow of spun, filtered, and inaccurate reporting of the events, pictures, and law certainly looked to me like persecution by the media. Even though there were recent pictures of the 17 year old Mr. Martin available the ones the media displayed were almost all taken when he was 14 and younger. The color picture of Zimmerman's face taken right after the shooting by one of the investigating cops with cellphone hardly made it onto the web or TV. The grainy black and white taken of him after he had been cleaned up were published far and wide.

The commentators also stated many times that since Zimmerman followed Martin it was his fault he was getting his ass whipped and because of that Zimmerman had no right to use deadly force to stop the ass whipping. I won't go into the morals but that is not the law in Florida. As I understand the "stand your ground" law, Zimmerman could have been following Martin, calling him names and using racial slurs. Zimmerman could have insulted Martin's race, his family, his looks, his character, his clothes ... But once Martin started to give him the ass whipping Zimmerman may have certainly deserved it was legal for Zimmerman to use deadly force to stop it. The media misreported this aspect of the law too.

Zimmerman was correctly found to not be guilty of murder or manslaughter. He was certainly guilty of making a few bad decisions but he did not commit a crime under Florida law.

mike: by packin a handgun on his weekly trip to the grocery store, did Zimmerman make a bad decision? ie: without the presence of a firearm, there is no way he could have shot anyone.

ed, in my opinion, he didn't make a bad decision when he chose to take his gun with him on his trip to the grocery store. Zimmerman made a bad decision when he got out of his car and followed Martin at night in the rain by himself. And I don't think Zimmerman would have done that had he not had a pistol.

But following Martin was not a crime. If Martin jumped Zimmerman because Zimmerman was following him Martin committed a crime. If Zimmerman shot Martin to stop the beating Martin was givinig him he did not commit a crime.

so, without a firearm, Zimmerman would have stayed in his car? and if Zimmerman would have stayed in his car, this whole thing would never have happened? sounds like carrying firearms on ones person or in ones car, while going about ones normal travels, sometimes leads to people getting shot and killed unnecessarily?

Well, using that logic it would seem that going to the grocery store was the cause. Or perhaps it was possession of a car and a driver's license. If he hadn't had a car he wouldn't have been out on that rainy evening. Or perhaps the error was not sending his wife to pick up the groceries. Or maybe it was his decision to live in the city instead of out on a farm where he could grow his own food.

I certainly wouldn't get out of my car in the rain at night and by myself to follow an individual I suspected might be about to commit a criminal act. If I was legally carrying a concealed weapon I still wouldn't do it. There are many, many, many reasons not to do that. That I might wind up in Zimmerman's shoes is just one of them. That the person I am following might might shoot me is another. That the cops might shoot me is another. That a criminal might sneak up behind me and take my gun and beat me is another.

By the way the New York Times reports that some politicians and "civil rights" leaders are already talking about Federal charges against Zimmerman:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/15/us/debate-on-race-and-justice-is-renewed.html?src=twr

" Senator Harry Reid, the majority leader, said that as a trial lawyer himself, 'I don�t always agree with what the jury does, but that�s the system, and I support the system.'

But he said he believed Floridians should take a close look at the law at the center of the case, which he called 'so unusual.'

He also said, in an interview on NBC�s 'Meet the Press,' that he thought President Obama should have a role as the public debate goes forward.

Both he and Mr. Jealous indicated that the federal government would pursue the case. The NAACP leader said that he and his staff had spoken to senior staff of Attorney General Eric Holder and had been assured that the Justice Department would study it carefully. "

So Zimmerman may have another trial, and another, and another. Another good reason to stay in the car.

I think if someone could look at the facts, there's no way to determine what Zimmerman would've done without a gun. I also believe Zimmerman thought his life was in danger when his head was buzzing from being hit into concrete and he felt like he was drowning in his own blood.

Ed, if Martin were on his way home, why did he put himself at risk of the unknown, when it was shown he had plenty of time to just go home and eat his candy. Maybe he was unnecessarily suicidal, and George was duped into assisting.

mike: I agree, there are many reasons why Zimmerman should have stayed in his car, rather than going afoot, armed and in pursuit of a suspicious character. in retrospect, it was a bad decision to leave the safely of his car. better if he had stayed in his car where he last saw martin and waited for a policeman to show up?

Everyone is capable of conjecture, only one of the two people who know the truth is here today. The jury got the prosecution's best pitch and the defense's.

Noone wins, someone is still dead. Only the two involved and God will know the truth of it. The rest of us to include the jury (who is in our system is accepted as the best suited to judge) will make a call one way or the other.

The great sadness in this is the not knowing and yet so many seem to know (actually opinion) so very much.

Most legal cases fall to this imperfect solution whether guilty or not. It is the reality of our past and our future.

The terrible part of the story is the emotion and opinion brought from various quarters regardless of factual knowledge.

As for the validity of his decision to pursue, I was once in a similar position. My car stolen from in front of my house after midnight, while on the phone with the dispatcher it drives by my house in front of my face. I leap into my other car to be told by the dispatcher they have police officer who has sight of it and not to pursue. I stopped as I tend to listen. I was wrong as the dispatcher either lied, or confused it with another call. My car was found several days later totaled. Note it took several days of chewing on the local police to even get them to admit to the facts. I had to demand the 911 call tapes to prove my point. So when I hear he should have listened, well it goes back to opinion.