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Craig, help me out here....

I recall that song- Helen Reddy= the fem-lib-lezzie with her "I am woman, hear me roar" anthem to Gloria Steinem and Helen Gurlie Brown- what a load of crap-- But what does opening Pandora's fabled box have to do with Delta Dawn, what's the flower you have on?? Pray Tell. I don't recall any lines in that song about opening boxes--

Craig, The problem with the Patriot Act is the same problem that gun control has....it turns law abiding citizens into criminals and it give big government entry into areas of our lives it has no business being in until we've committed a crime. And the anti gun people would describe the gun "problem" in the US today as a war they need to fight.

A couple thoughts having finally read most of this thread.

First, as noted by a few way back, the devil is in the details. The anti gun people will construct laws and publicize what they are proposing as the most reasonable of actions. Until you read the fine print of what actually gets enacted.

Second, the oft repeated statement here about back ground checks being the Trojan horse for registry is, IMHO, correct. Much better, again, IMHO, if you have to have something, to have a licensing system like ours in Canada. It is divorced from the specific gun. As long as the transaction is between licenced citizens, then no one is telling anyone about any specific gun. And yet, the person you are selling your gun to is unlikely to be a gang banger. Please don't take this as support for licensing. It's just not as bad as registries.

Finally, you are going to lose the fight. Maybe not this time. But you will eventually. Because in protecting the specific 2cd amendment right, the pro gun lobby never wins a convert. Too much logic and not enough emotion. The other side has been whipping our asses on this for 40 years straight now. And we keep responding the same way.

My 8 year old boy was selected to represent his grade three class at a public speaking contest. While waiting to hear him, I listened to a cute and appealing little girl from grade four give her speech on why guns are bad. They kill people. Until we figure out how to counter that, our cause is lost.

plain as pudding

Dear god, Craig, where does Bush come into it or curveballs or undermining pro-gun efforts? I've written to a senator, the NRA and posted here, as Jim noted above, recognize what is going on for what it is: registration.

Chatter about slippery slopes and nibbling away at constitutional rights is mewling to the converted. Nowhere have I said I want "American gun control to resemble Canadian gun control." I fought gun control, period.

I've said, plain as pudding, that none of the proposals for gun control will have a gnat's eyelash of effect on gun violence. I've quoted the Harvard study here and reminded McCain of Canadian experience so cut out the nonsense, please.

Integrity of a conversation demands respect, candour and trustworthiness. Imputing motives without evidence and saying what is not true is disrespectful, only making the world safer for fools.

Any time you're taking on the stately edifice and authority of a national government trying to saddle its citizens with unwarranted arbitrary measures, look to help wherever you can get it, not obfuscate and declaim as you're doing.

Simple..if THEY don't drop it...we pursue a progran to deny them freedom of speech...under the same argument that its not unlimited...and idiots flapping their gums like them are more dangerous than bootleg liqueur or homemade drugs are. And certainly far more dangerous than any gun is.