doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Verney-Carron Helicobloc

Anybody had first-hand experience with one of these guns? This one is a 12 ga. with 70mm chambers and extractors weighing 6.25 lbs. I am still working a manufacture date. The quality of the engraving and the wood suggest a well-made gun (too bad the screws have been messed with).

Can anyone shed any light on Helicobloc locking mechanism? Thanks in advance, Doverham

Good company which I believe is still in business. The gun is a boxlock with sideplates, but looks like a very nice gun. The wood is of high quality. If you do a search here for Helibloc [spelling??] I think you will find some good info on the system.

I think it's a standard A & D & top extension (kind of like a Webley & Scott), but the toplever/spindle arrangement is a little different.

See how there's not screw in the toplever? I think they eliminated it in a process that cut out some other pieces and lowered costs.

I had a French 16g made on the same kind of action.

OWD

Thanks Daryl. V-C is definitely still in business, though focused more these days on rifles and OUs. I tried searching for Helico and Helice rather than Helicobloc and found a bit more information.

OWD - does your 16 ga. have "helice" or "helico" marked on it somewhere?

Not sure. I don't have it any more, either.

I swear I've seen Helice, or something like that, on other French doubles.

OWD

yes a 20 ga really nice gun it had extra locking bolt on top of the purdy under bolt the 20 was a really good looking, great balanced gun.it wasn't mine, but it looked like a lot of work to fit the locking bolts.verny carron still makes really nice SXS

Helice is a French word for what we call ZZ birds, or Electrocibles, the game that is a "replacement" for live pigeon shooting. It is widely practiced in Europe.

Maybe Helibloc is a French name derived from Helix, meaning
propeller (which is what the Helice target is propelled by) and bloc, maybe meaning "to stop".

Just a shot in the dark.

SRH

Actually, in this case, the name doesn't have anything to do with the ZZ bird game. Rather, it means screw or spiral, and refers to the mechanical nature of the locking system. As OWD notes, there are similarities to the Scott spindle, but it's basically upside down, with the screw coming up from the bottom (which is why none is visible in the top lever).

Doverham, French doubles are very difficult to date accurately. V-C is indeed still in business, and they may be able to give you a range of dates within which your gun was produced. My best guess would be between the wars; less likely, perhaps shortly after WWII. But V-C no longer has most of its old records, and they won't be able to date the gun for you by serial number. However, when I wrote them years ago about a V-C gun I owned, they were kind enough to furnish pages from a period catalog which allowed me to identify the model, and to come up with a ballpark range of dates.

Thanks for the responses. From the limited information I have come across, V-C patented a triple locking action similar to the Webley action in the early 1900s called the Helice grip. It was modified/improved over time and had various names including Helicobloc and Heli 33. VC let the patent expire for some reason and other French makers used it and often marked their guns with similar names - Helico, Helistop, Helicogrip. There are some patent diagrams posted on this link (en Francais, bien sur)

Gournet

Larry - thanks for the tip on reaching out to VC, that sounds worthwhile.

Here is a photo of the proof marks:

Ham if you want to know how the "Helice" system work send me a mail and I scan the picture and info from my book : Les armuriers de Saint Etienne en catalogues.
Marc.