doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com First Aid Kit

With all of the seasons openning, and getting my side by sides guns ready, I was getting my first aid kit out to assess what's left of it after several seasons on neglect.

Well it's been pilfered down to not much use. So, I'm rebuilding it with two dogs in mind.

This list is from a forum for gun dogs that some vet tech posted

Novalsan Solution
Saline (and syringes to flush wounds or eyes)
Alcohol wipes
Gauze Squares
Vet-wrap
Telfa Pads
Bandage Gauze
Elastikon Tape (Vet Wrap)
Hemostats
Bandage Scissors
Quik Stop - clotting powder
Thermometer
Prednisone 20mg (5)
Metronidazole 250mg (10) (Flagyl) antibotic for skin infections
Benadryl 25mg (10) (diphenhydramine)
Rimadyl 25mg (10) NSAID pain reliever
Famotidine 20mg (5) Pepsid

I'd add Tramadol for pain.

What's in your kit?

All of the above plus: tweezers, dog muzzle, LOTS of saline solution, LOTS of VetWrap, skunk kit, stapler, EMT gel, and, most importantly, local Vet locations and phone numbers. I am sure I left something out...

I'm not a dog guy, but what about the vet equivalent of DermaBond?

personally, I prefer a pint of Dewar's for most any emergency...

That is a great list. I want to emphasis the value of Rimadyl as a pain reliever. Take the time to find it and buy it. All the other stuff can treat an injury, but a Rimadyl tab will relax the dog and give it a good nights rest or trip to vet.

Nail clippers and file. Snakebite kit?

The muzzle is key. Some folks will throw in a couple sanitary napkins, which can be used in lieu of gauze pads or to pad an injury. I'd also take an old IV bag or two - they make admirable, durable temporary protective boots. You may want to throw in an heavy-duty oversized sling in case you need to carry the pup out.

I'd also throw a "cone of shame" in the vehicle. Disassembled flat, they take up next to no room.

Chuck what is the Prednisone 20mg (5)for?

I prefer aspirin to other pain relievers as it doesn't affect the liver or kidneys.

I also carry baking soda, Dawn Liquid detergent and bottel (or two) of Hydrogen Peroxide to kill the skunk smell and other nasty things bird dogs have and affinity for rolling in.

If the dog is bleeding, aspirin can interfere with clotting. Same for humans.

What on Earth is a cone of shame in this context, anyway?

I used to call it a Victorian Collar.

The cone keeps'em from gnawing off their hurt leg...Geo

I'd like to step in a address a few comments. I'm no vet, but my understanding is that Prednisone will reduce the inflammation (inside and out) associated with a hemotoxic snakebite. Same, to a lessor degree, for benadryl. And, of course, aspirin might be a bad idea on a hemotoxic snakebite due to the bleeding issue.

I'd also add superglue and moleskin to fix footpad and skin cuts.

What is a dosage for Tramadol for Dogs ?

I have some left over from an injury - so I could use some in a dog emergency I suppose if I knew a dosage.

My vet gave me 50mg tramadol (ultram) tabs for a 60lb pointer. For a 30lb dog I would break the tramadol tablet in half. Or you could start with half tab and give more if needed. I think Rimadyl, which is an NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory)......sort of like ibuprofen, works very well in dogs, but you don't want to over do it because NSAIDS can be hard on a dog's stomach and kidneys. Tramadol has a narcotic effect.

I agree but if the dog (or person) is injured enough to cause bleeding I see no reason to give it an analgesic of any type until after the wound is closed and the bleeding is stopped.

SuperGlue (cyanoacrylate) is the hardware store version of DermaBond. DermaBond (for human use) is not available over the counter, but I have been told that there is a veterinary version that is available. I have also been cautioned not to use standard cyanoacrylate on animals or on myself because it seals so well that it induces infection. My experience with medical DermaBond was very positive, when an ER doc glued my finger tip back together without stitches.

I'm a physician and use dermabond regularly for minor wounds in humans. Dogs, however, lick their wounds, and though I'm not a vet, I'm guessing dermabond wouldn't last 30 seconds with licking and all. I've used surgical staple guns in dogs with success. It's easy. Make sure wound is clean and staple. Not much to it. Dogs handle pain well and don't hardly flinch without an anesthetic. Also, prior to closing you want to make sure there is NO foreign body and cleanse with an antiseptic , like iodine or isopropyl alcohol, irrigate with clean water, then make sure skin is well approximated prior to closing with the staples! This procedure is only indicated for minor, superficial wounds. If the wound is deep, you better find a vet!

I also carry 3% peroxide to induce vomiting if necessary and I always carry a leatherman on my belt when hunting with a dog (removing cactus, quills, etc.) Instead of tramadol you could substitute with medicam however I do have one dog who has a reaction to medicam.

My lab was 40lbs when she was spayed. The vet prescribed 50mg twice a day. I've used 50mg just for muscular pain after a hard hunting day on her. Recently, the vet prescribed 50mg twice a day for her arthritis. From what I've read, Tramadol is a low side effect pain reliever.


Buzz,
In recent years I've heard more and more not to use antiseptics for deep wounds. Is that correct?

If you don't carry a multitool, the smallest finest tip needlenose pliers is very handy for removing porcupine quills if you have porkies around and one of those dogs that just can't resist.... I've even removed broken-off quills from between back teeth with mine.

The best tweezers I've found for removing cactus spines from man or beast are the tiny, fine ones that come with many Swiss Army knives. If you don't like to carry a Swiss Army knife (I don't) or if you've lost the tweezers, you can get them separately from Victorinox dealers like www.southerntackle.com Best to keep them in the knife or in a separate baggie--tiny and VERY easy to lose.

Some GREAT dog medication ideas and information here--thanks to all and to Chuck for starting the thread!

For removing cholla (choy'-ya) cactus tines from my dog, I've found that a small set of needlenose plier work well. You just can't pull many of them out by hand. Cholla is the nastiest cactus I've encountered. The tines are about 1 1/2"-2" long and are microscopically barbed. I've decided I won't hunt in the stuff with or without my dog. I've ridden horses thru forests of the stuff and pulled out literally thousands of the tines from dozens of horses. My lab took a half hour to remove the tines from one encounter. No more.

The term "cone of shame" comes from that computer-animated movie "Up", where the inventor makes the collar box that translates dog language into human. One of the dogs winds up wearing a cone for some reason and all the other dogs are then heard snickering at and making fun of him having to wear the "Cone of Shame".

I hadn't seen the movie when, walking my dog during recovery from something or other that necessitated the cone, a toddler out with his mom said "Mommy, that dog's wearing the cone of shame!" The kid's mom explained it to me.

Moving on to ChuckH's post on avoiding cholla cactus, that might state the core principle of any first aid kit - insofar as possible avoid the places and situations that would require actual medical/first aid treatment.

Thanks. Very helpful information.

One note. My vet says only use buffered asprin as unbuffered is very hard on the dog.

I'd agree with others above about having a muzzle in there. The nicest pet can snap when hurt badly. I watched two instances that started out trying to help a dog in distress and ended with the dog being ignored and all the attention focused on the human bite victim. One was a bite high on the cheek just under someones eye that needed a bunch of stitches and the other a piece of someones ear was loped off. Both times the people were leaning over hurt dogs to pick them up.

Regarding a dog sling, I think my bird vest will work well for the task. Anyone try it?

One of my setters had trouble with exertional hypoglycemia; he'd run until he would collapse. I carried a couple of peanut butter granola bars and would give him 1/3 every 20-30 minutes. He was smart enough (always a dog training problem for me when they are smarter than me) that he'd come in and look at my vest pocket if he needed a boost. I also carried a Glucose Gel tube and used it a couple of times.

Pointing the wiley winged Missouri squirrel, much to the enjoyment of the hunting party

That's not half as embarrassing as my first Brittany that would catch and retrieve carp from the shallow streams where we hunted in Nebraska along the sandy bottom land in the Platte river valley.

Moving on to ChuckH's post on avoiding cholla cactus, that might state the core principle of any first aid kit - insofar as possible avoid the places and situations that would require actual medical/first aid treatment. [/quote]

That would be a difficult advice to follow. I would have to avoid a large percentage of the places I hunt. I think rather than avoid plan for an encounter and how to fix that whether it is from your first aid box or something the dog is already prepared for i.e. skid plate, neoprene vest, doggy boots, carry a water tray, etc.

I should have emphasized the "insofar as possible". If you don't have to go through the cholla (or whatever), don't.

Chuck,
Great topic. My understanding is that Benedryl is useful for venonomous snakebites to prevent suffocation due to the airway closing because of swelling and to buy time on the way to a vet for antivenom treatment if necessary.
Is there a topical ointment that tastes awful to dogs? I put some on my Britt today on a small abdominal wound and it might as well have been peanut butter the way she licked it off. I considered the "Cone of Shame" but she hates my guts for days when I put it on her.
Dave, It's my understanding that snakebite suction kits are no longer recommended for humans or animals.
Gil

There are no poisonous snakes naturally occurring in Maine , so I kinda fell behind on the latest recommendations in that department.

Chuck: The literature currently states that antiseptics such as Betadine or alcohol can be caustic to tissue and delay healing. Most dog wounds, though, would be considered dirty, eg, from a stub , fighting wild hogs, etc. I think benefit outweighs risk and would use an antiseptic trying to kill bacteria in a dirty wound, then rinse with saline or clean water before closing the wound. Just my opinion though.

Buzz,
Thanks.

"snakebite suction kits are no longer recommended for humans or animals" is correct.
The canine antivenom is expensive but quite effective if administered within 4 hours. My Vet is not a believer in the vaccine, and there are LOTS of snakebites in AZ

http://www.findavet.us/2011/01/how-to-treat-your-dog-after-a-snake-bite/

And re: closing wounds. Aggressive irrigation is needed (I use a saline eye solution squirt bottle) to be sure no foreign matter remains in the laceration.

Kemo sabe, your vet is not alone.
http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/whatsnew/article.cfm?id=1883

Couldn't agree more, Drew. Aggressive irrigation not only aids in flushing particulate matter from a wound, but probably flushes out bacteria as well.

My understanding from my vets explanation is that the vaccine is western diamondback specific.

Even though the vaccine is Western Diamondback specific it is my understanding that there is some spillover in protection to the other snakes. This includes Copperheads and the other rattlesnake varieties with the exception of the Mojave rattler. I know some Vets that ARE big believers in the vaccine having treated multiple dogs with and without prior vaccination. To me, anyway, if there is a chance it helps and with the cost pretty minimal, why not?? Very cheap insurance in my opinion. None of my dogs have had any adverse reactions other than an occasional slight swelling at the injection site.

Mojave "green" rattlers have both hemotoxic and neurotoxic venom. Odds are that a person or dog bitten are not going to make it, if the snake dumped it's venom.

I have been told the problem with comparing symptoms of vaccinated dogs bitten by rattlesnakes with symptoms of un-vaccinated victims is that about half the time the rattlesnake doesn't inject venom.

I do have my dogs vaccinated though.

You're starting to repeat yourself. That's a sign of old age.

What repeat? What are you talking about? Are you off your meds again?

St. Patrick drive the snakes out of Maine, too?

Another coagulant/disinfectant....cayenne

Quote:

"Cayenne pepper should be in everyone's first aid kit. If you have a severe cut which is bleeding profusely, apply cayenne pepper, a powerful styptic, directly into the wound. The cayenne will equalize the blood pressure and start the coagulating of blood immediately. It is a powerful disinfectant so there is no need to worry about infection setting in. My family has been using cayenne in this manner for years and, as a result, take what others consider miraculous results for granted."

"When purchasing cayenne, AVOID buying it from the spice department in your grocery store. Most herbs and spices are irradiated, rendering them ineffective medicinally. Instead, purchase a 30,000 to 40,000 BTU (British Thermal Units) or HU (heat units) cayenne pepper from a company which guarantees that their products are not irradiated."

from this site...many benefits

http://www.healthfreedom.info/cayenne%20pepper.htm

I bet that hurts worse than the wound does!...Geo

Yep, definitely want the muzzle muzzled before you put the cayenne on the cut.

My dad was chopping wood when he was a young lad. The axe glanced and put a gash in the top of his foot. His dad reached into his mouth, pulled out his cud and slapped it in the cut. Obviously, my dad did survived.

Could be, but it would have been before my time so I can't say one way or the other. I will say that many Mainers will say that in June Maine is greener than Ireland any time. It's pretty darn green but I've never been to Eire so I can't say one way or the other on that, too.

The problem is that the other color is white, like in cold stuff.

Why not ask your vet for their thoughts on such a kit, if you care for your dogs?

Not a problem, that. Keeps away the soft and weak. Prevents heat-addled brains. And gives time and impetus to working on projects.