doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com French Shotgun, any info?

The layered accents can be really strange. I just listened to an Asian woman speaking English with a very "posh" English accent. I hate to say it but it was hilarious.

Larry,
My last Uggie boxlock was a Falcon 12, with a hidden third fastener, in probably 95% condition-and it was a whopping $375 on gunbroker. The biggest problem with that gun was the white line pad that was installed. You can do it, that is, buy very decent boxlocks for under the $600 mark, if you look and are patient. By the way, the bits for Spanish guns all come from the same steel cooperative, and the "soft" parts are not limited to POS guns. The skill set of the employees of any given Spanish gunmaking concern is more relevant than the name on the gun.
The mindset that you have displayed that ALL Belgian guns are knock-off cheapies is flat out wrong, Larry. The gun pictured by me is a good quality A & D boxlock, equal to most A & D boxlocks coming out of France. Further, no gun shot longer, or, better, simply because it is Helice locked. The Verney Carron patent would have you believe otherwise, but, it didn't change our destiny or even change the fact that a well made boxlock from anywhere across the pond would last several lifetimes of hard use.
There is a Charlin listed on gunbroker right now that is at $480, but, sliding breech pricing is all over the map, and not really indicative of pricing on boxlocks, helice guns, or, otherwise.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=284769470

If a guy waited until this auction ended and offered up $600 for this gun, I'll bet he'd get it. Helice gun, too.

Keep an eye on your meds, Larry.

Best,
Ted

Ted, it sold for that because it was marked Falcon, and you had to know what you were looking at (which most buyers--especially of cheapies--don't) to know that it was an Uggie. If it were a more modern Uggie and not marked only with some importer's name, it would have cost more.

Given the fact that I've owned a bunch of Belgian guns--maybe even more than you--I'm well aware that they're not all knock-off cheapies. However, I thought maybe you'd been into the sauce more than a little when we started out talking about French guns, and you posted one from Belgium as an example. And it may well be a "good quality A&D", but there's simply too little information in that particular ad to judge much of anything. You didn't skip over the much higher priced French boxlocks to which I referred, did you? Off the same website . . . right there, under "French shotguns" . . . which is a darned good place to start, when you want to compare prices of French guns.

As for the comments about Helice, I spoke with JJ down at Champlin when I was doing an article on French guns, several years back. He had very good things to say about the Helice lockup--which, of course, is also evidenced by the fact that, after the V-C patent expired, there were plenty of St. Etienne guns made using the Helice system.

Stay off the sauce, Ted. And if you want to have an intelligent discussion on the pricing of FRENCH shotguns, then you might start out by posting FRENCH boxlock (non-sliding breech) examples rather than going next door to Belgium. Especially when French examples are readily available, on the very website you used.

Education these days, I guess, just ain't what it used to be.

On the other hand I went to an importers office on business and there was a tall, thin, fair-haired, blue-eyed guy jabbering away on the phone in Chinese. His speech was so spontaneous and natural if I'd shut my eyes I'd have never known that the fellow speaking was probably British.
Steve

Larry, a model 30 is pretty much a model 30. I see the same guns listed over and over again at higher prices. Mostly, they don't sell. They shouldn't. New model 30s are cheap enough not to screw with someone else's $1300, formerly new gun.
'Nother one, Larry-priced right where I said it should be.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=285013933

The sky is the limit one how much you WANT to spend, but, super French (and, otherwise) boxlocks sell for right in that price range I posted.


YOU can (and, should) spend all you want, but, that doesn't mean the price is right.

No sauce here, Larry. Just reality. And a few decent guns in the safe with slim outlay into them.

You should try it. Reality, I mean.

Best,
Ted

A low price on one gun, Ted--without looking at it in hand--doesn't mean it's "right". Nor does a high price. You can find plenty of both by poking around on the Internet.

Just as you did, I bought a Falcon a couple years back for less than $400; eventually sold it for more than I paid. But that's kinda like finding a Sears Ranger and paying less for it than the same gun marked as a Marlin 90 or a Hunter Fulton: same gun, better price because it didn't say Marlin or Hunter, and a lot of folks don't know it's the same gun. But the market price for a Marlin 90 or a Hunter Fulton is based on guns so marked, not on those wearing other clothing. Find one of the "disguised" ones . . . yes, you can get a bargain, IF you know about the disguise. That's one way in which this BB can be very helpful.

Here is the Charlin, Larry:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=285076369

It's wearing a good disquise-there are some Charlin features, but, it is actually an R Darne patent gun with a removable breech-notice that axle, for the key to rotate around, in the sliding breech. It's not a bad price, but, it really isn't a Charlin. I have heard of, and seen photos of these guns, but, never held one or seen a catalog describing them. I don't consider the R design on a Charlin a deal breaker, but, some might. At $600 as I type, thats a bargain-we'll have to watch to see where it ends up.

I still maintain that the great majority of guns we actually use and hunt with, have taken a pretty big hit in the marketplace since 2006, or so. That hit has been especially hard on double guns from the continent.

Stuff like the Tzar's Parker may be exempted, but, doesn't matter, to most of us, anyway.

Best,
Ted

Didn't even break 1 large, Larry. Like I said, stuff off the continent has taken a big hit.


Best,
Ted

Not to the extent, Ted, that you're going to buy a nice, used Uggie 30 for $400 or so. Unless maybe it says "Dickson Falcon", and you're one of those in the know that it's really an Uggie.