doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Double Rifles, Paradox Guns & Gauge Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Thouoghts on the 12 bore Pedersoli.

Made it to Cabellas in Pa yesterday and finally got a chance to handle the 12bore dr that they carry.
It was a handfull to say the least. I had seen and fired the 58 in the past but it had an entirely different feel to it. Also, nobody could answer the question regarding twist rate. Somewhere I saw it listed as 1/48 which seems way too fast for a ball gun.
If anyone has any experience with it, it would be nice to know how the gun is to work with. The price is a reasonable one.

Too bad Pedersoli didn't simply bore the blanks from the 58 out for this thing. Could have been a great handling gun.

Tom

also remember see a 1/48 twist on the perdersoli website

1/48 is a compromise twist for ball and conical. Invented by the Hawken Bros., I think. 1/24 can be relied upon to rip the patch from a RB, but 1/48 generally won't, while it is fast enough to stabilize a conical.

I have a .54 rifle with 1/48 and it will shoot ball or conical to minute of deer at 100 yds. Or sabot, for that matter. Actually, it shoots pretty much whatever I put in it, although I haven't tried the old "bent nails & gravel" load.

RB target shooters demand 1/66 or 1/72, but stopping rifles don't need pinpoint accuracy. 1/48 is fine for whatever it is a .72 dbl is good for.

I hit the Dixie site on Brent's advice and the twist on the 12 is around 1/80?. That twist is good for a roundnose solid conical upward of 750gr.
This could be an interesting gun to work with. I just wonder how badly the regulation would be affected withthe heavy slug. The site lists the suggested load as a ball with 80 gr of powder, and I wonder if that is the load the gun is regulated for.

Tom

Tom,
I'm not sure how long a 750 12 bore bullet is, but using a bore diamter of .725, a twist of 80" and a velocity of 1200, I get the following estimates of bullet length:
Greenhill (constant=150) = 0.986"
Greenhill (constant=125) = 0.821"
Carr = 0.845"
Crawley's Greenhill = 0.797"
Lilja = 0.788"
Charlie Dell = 0.797"

Note that most bp rifles generally are better approximated by smaller constants than the 150 used in the original Greenhill. This being the case then bullets on the order of 0.8" plus or minus a bit would seem to be better bets. That's pretty close to roundballs too.

Brent

Tom, contact James Gates @ Dixie Slugs for info on using his big 12ga Terminator Slugs in the 12ga "Alaskan Big Bore Double". James cast some of his Terminators in pure lead for a few guys using the Doubles and they were very impressed by the accuracy and power.

From the Dixie Slugs Main Page :

I went to the range, put four consecutive shots (left and right) without cleaning at 50 yds.into a group that can be covered with an ordinary business card!
140gr. Goex .022" card under the slug and a .118" paper wad over the slug (Musket cap and nipple) slug does not move at all in second barrel under recoil.
THANKS!
Abe K.
(Alaskan Hunter)



GOOD LUCK!

I'm really starting to consider this thing, but I want to run the ballistics to see what is worth shooting through it. I just wonder if the ball is the best bet when you get to the larger caliber rifles of this type. It probably shoots flatter than the conical and I have seen what a .58 round ball does, I can only imagine what a .72 will do at similar velocities.

Tom

Friends All........Gloria Ardesi from Pedersoli just sent me an email with the barrel specs on their rifled 12 bore double......Bore@.724" and Groove@.732"
Some clarification about Dixie Slugs....we have developed a line of 3" 12 ga slug loads for rifled barrels that are designed for modern firearms. However, we do supply both muzzle loaders and those that load fixed ammo, two different styles of 12 bore slugs, both around 730 grs, depending on alloy or pure lead. Both run about .732", again depending on the metal mix. Both are "squared" (length vs diameter. The Terminator slug has a crimp groove for those loading brass hulls......James@Dixie Slugs

Dixie,

I have noticed that there isn't any difference in velocity between 2-3/4 inch and 3 inch slugs in the several major ammo factory sites. I assume that with a given projectile weight, and a maximum pressure limit, that there is enough space for all the powder needed in a 2-3/4" shell. If that is true, why are there any 3 inch slugs being made at all? Is it to satisfy the customer who thinks bigger is better? What is your opinion of getting a rifled choke tube for my Browning Gold vs. buying a fully rifled barrel for slugs. I have noticed that some manufacturers are producing 12 gauge slug loads with velocities around 1900 fps. I assume that the projectile is lighter than the normal 1 ounce slug to get that velocity. What is your opinion of these slug loads?

James - Thanks for the reply. I'm interested in both the muzzleloader and 2 3/4" cartridge slugs. CCCB