doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Pattern and Shotstring question...

Mike, thanks for putting numbers to my intuition!

JC

JayCee,

I have no life.

Mike, I was tempted to take a stab at that myself but it involves trig. Having failed that class, and gone on to an ignominious non-mathematical career I'll defer to Don A.

The actual muzzle speed is a good bit less than target speed, and it's the angular rate of change that matters - or in our case doesn't matter because it's so tiny.

Actually I am an excellent teacher and students, except slackers, love my classes and fill waiting lists. That is because not only do I provide basic information and refs, I challenge them to actually read and think on their own. You would likely not do well in my classes.

Dr.WtS

Phi, actually Wonko DID answer your question. All you needed to do was refer to the book he mentioned: Bob Brister's "Shotgunning: The Art and the Science". That's a must have, for anyone serious about shotguns and ballistics. In it, Brister shot at moving pattern boards (towed by his wife, behind the family station wagon), some of them at quite long range. He includes quite a few photos of the resulting patterns. The idea that moving the muzzle is going to do anything that will show on the pattern board is a bit like the old idea that you might be able to save your life if you're in a falling elevator by jumping just before it hits. The one event takes place too quickly, the other not quickly enough. But maybe, if you're an NBA star with extremely good "hang time" . . .

Several of us have answered your question, already. The comparison to a hose nozzle is quite ridiculous, to begin with. The water is coming out as a continuous stream. The shot exits the muzzle as a short mass, as shown in the pictures. If you could burp an inch long slug of water out of a hose, it would not be bent by moving the hose nozzle, either. You've had your answers, you're just refusing to read and accept the logic contained in them. Proving that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him think.

That's not an answer though L. Brown. That's passing the buck. I obviously don't have that book. That's why I asked the question.



THAT is an answer and I thank you. You've brought a new demension to this conversation. Perhaps if Wonko had taken the time to instruct rather than tell his student to "look it up" maybe certain comments wouldn't have been warranted.

Yes sir, NOW many people have answered the question (including yourself) and I thank you all. But only 7 people actually contributed to this conversation. Stan, Ben-T, Rocketman, ShotgunJones, L. Brown, Mike Campbell (after initially not contributing, later did contribute) and yourself. The rest of the 40 some odd posts are either passing the buck, making fun of me, or simply saying that my ideas are poppycock without explaining why. Can you see how those comments are not effective in answering my question? These people didn't contribute a single intelligable comment to this thread: KY Jon, Jimmy W, HomelessJoe, JayCee Wonko and you Jim (initially but did eventually contribute something of worth). Wonko and Kensal Rise passed the buck to other references that, if I'd had those books I'm sure would have answered my question.

I'm sorry but I thought he point of this kind of forum was to have conversations like this and dispell rumors and myths. In my 129 posts on this forum I've been persecuted for God knows how many different things. You guys must like keeping your membership elite, because you've got to be running people off. I'm darn close to giving up on this forum myself.

It's sad that people who can be so cool to talk to and have so much information to share can be so full of piss and vinegar.

My dear Phi,

I take umbrage at your comment. My only intended contribution was to make you
think. Honestly intended and not wanting to offend or put off.

Sorry if my intentions were off mark.

JC

OK JayCee. I can see how your posts were pretty innocuous. I'm sorry, I guess these other guys just had me in a bad frame of mind.