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#190851 - 06/01/10 12:03 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: LRF]
Ken Nelson Offline

Registered: 01/08/02
Posts: 1881
Loc: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Additionally I believe Hacker Martin was Roy Southgate's mentor who continued the tradition of the scratch built rifle.
Anonymity's next to cleanliness and I don't have to tell you what that's next to.

#190859 - 06/01/10 12:48 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: LRF]
CHN Offline

Registered: 07/23/08
Posts: 7
Hammerback - Got to poking around and found a short history
of Hacker Martin. His mill was located near Grey's Station,Tn.
This was also the location of his shop. He did indeed make
make all fittings, lock, stock and possibly even the barrel.
This info is contained in "Supplement to The Muzzle-Loading
Cap-Lock Rifle" by Ned Roberts copyrighted June, 1944. Now
for something interesting!
On pages 527 & 528 is a rifle made about 1942 for Kimble Arms Co., Woburn, Mass. and described as a 44 Cal. roundball flinklock, 1 inch 42inch barrel and weighing 11 1/2 lbs.
The stock contained silver patch box and 30 silver inlays all
cut and shaped by hand with tiger stripe maple full length stock.
Comparing your pictures with those on page 528, I reckon this is your rifle.
Hope this helps. You have a very fine rifle. If you intend to
"make some smoke" have the lock screws atended to by a top smith. You may consider contacting The Muzzle Loading Rifle Assoc. for more info.

Best to you and yours,

#190860 - 06/01/10 12:52 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: CHN]
BrentD Offline

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 2857
Loc: Iowa
Why all the concern with the lock screws?

Hell of a nice rifle!


#190862 - 06/01/10 01:09 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: BrentD]
SKB Offline

Registered: 12/31/01
Posts: 3432
Loc: Colorado
Because locks work much better when screwed into the gun.

New website just launched, check it out.

#190877 - 06/01/10 02:39 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: SKB]
BrentD Offline

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 2857
Loc: Iowa
Well, I didn't notice that they were missing. I thought, however that it was in reference to screws internal to the lock itself. I'll try to pay closer attention next time.

Hell of a nice rifle though.


#190879 - 06/01/10 02:46 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: BrentD]
mc Offline

Registered: 03/31/02
Posts: 1337
Loc: so.california
i used to do business with a guy in grey Tenn. he was showed how to engrave by lester smith.smith did a lot of work for Mr. Martin.Martin moved to virginia later on and i think his shop burned down.any way his name is Don Davison he had a shop in grey and built muzzle loaders (really nice rifles) i dont know if he is still around but he would have information on everyone in the region good luck. mc(if you find Don tell him Mark Cooper said hello)

#198757 - 08/09/10 10:55 PM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: mc]
Jerry V Lape Offline

Registered: 01/01/02
Posts: 2512
Loc: Tempe, AZ
Just a precaution, but I was almost injured by an old blackpowder rifle thought to be unloaded for years. Have you checked to be sure this one is unloaded? I would think twice about the need to fire this rifle as it is a collectible of significant value - not buggered up by range work.

Edited by Jerry V Lape (08/09/10 10:57 PM)

#199230 - 08/13/10 08:45 AM Re: Flintlock Rifle [Re: Jerry V Lape]
JohnM Offline

Registered: 01/01/02
Posts: 1074
Loc: West End of Lake Erie...USA
NOT an expert.

However, there is a an OP book about Hacker Martin, well illustrated. Remember that he started building long before the modern longrifle scholarship started. So, you will find some eclectic styling choices mixed together on the same rifle, as he incorporated ideas and materials that he liked from different sources.

As well, I knew an old fellow who 'knew a bit' of Hacker Martin lore. He said that Martin and other ML gunsmiths of the time used old vintage parts: locks, trim, DST triggers that were readily available, taken off of broken or unusable guns. I specifically asked him about Martin's recycling another time, and replied [more or less] "that it didn't take a thing away from his reputation, as he did make his own locks, too. As well, there was no good reason back then, not to use perfectly good vintage parts in a new build."

The old boy was a late fifties and sixties regular at Friendship, and had built some few LR's himself. And, he'd sat around campfires down there swapping lore with the real oldtimers. And, he was always on the hunt for usable old parts, especially good English locks. A sound Manton flinter was cherished, I can tell you. So, while his statement is oral history regarding Martin in particular, even I am old enough to remember a M/L clan guy swapping in a vintage lock to replace some early poorly cast and finished replica lock.

As SDH and other will testify, we live in an abundance of resources for the average guy to assemble rifles from well-made quality mfg's that would have the old-timers pretty happy. Are the results equal to the supremo artistic technical tour-de-force efforts of a Bivins, Gusler, House,SDH, Mandarino and the other members of the Modern Pantheon? Of course not. But a person can buy a decent well-designed, sparking, tuned lock for a relative pittance today from someone like Chambers.

There just wasn't anything to compare to that for Hacker and his contemporaries, of which I'm aware. So, having a perfectly good lock to hand back then, was a real good step towards building a rifle. As most of you are prob'ly aware, parts re-usage is nothing new in the field of building fine guns. ;~`)

ENDORSE Jerry's advice: doublecheck ANY M/L -- old or new -- for loads in the bbl. Black powder WILL fire after a century of being tamped under newspaper wadding, topped with patched lead. A surprising number of those pieces were put away behind a barn door or in a pumphouse, stoked and ready to roar at the next chicken stealing varmint -- two or four legged. As my Black Swamp farming grandfather informed my father during the Depression, regarding tramps and Great-Grampa's habit of cracking a bullet past them on sight, "There's always room for one more behind the barn."

However, the family guns and other antiques, dating back from the post-Revolutionary migration to the Ohio River, and then North after the Civil War, and on thru the 20th Century were lost in the Flint,Mi/NW Ohio tornado of June 8, 1953. The twister got all four family farms and a cousin. I-75 and it's barrow pits run thru the land now.

However, an elderly neighbor in the small town in which I grew up, had a garage that literally was festooned with longrifles, hung from rafters,walls, and benches piled with pistols and other 'old stuff'. It was all just curio status goods back then. Never have lost my interest in those archaic longen-boomers, and their times. Wish the board members who pursue such items,"Happy Hunting

some useful sites:

* http://www.longrifle.ws/forsale/default.asp?categoryID=all

* National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association -- www.NMLRA.org

* Coon 'N Crockett Muzzleloaders Club -- www.Coon-n-Crockett.org

* Armory Hill Living History Association -- www.armoryhill.com

* Kentucky Rifle Association -- www.kentuckyrifleassociation.org

* Hog Heaven Muzzleloaders -- www.hogheavenmuzzleloaders.com/index02.htm

* The Honourable Company of Horners -- www.hornguild.org

* `Kentucky Longrifle Virtual Museum` of original rifles and makers -- americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=d85qehjtvk2auti5n77o

* Cook Inlet Mountaineers ,muzzleloader/black powder shooting club -- www.cookinletmountaineers.org/home.html

Relax; we're all experts here.

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