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Forums10
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Mar 29th, 2024
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,270 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,270 Likes: 201 |
Roy, your info. is interesting. My memory of Alber Brown was from talks with the late Lanny Sampson, who was a good collector and researcher. Can you tell me the period James Charles Scott was engraving ? In your opinion, are the Lefever and Remington birds by the same engraver ? Of course, I know that kind of thing is hard to answer.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
Homeless-
Nice Scott. Where's the shield on that Scott hammergun you picked up a little while back - the one with the straight grip?
Thanks
OWD It's not a Premier the sheild is underneath...here's a nice very early Premier 1O hammer gun, they say 1874. Not much choke. http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/conten...erarchyId=11655My 1881 10 ga. is almost identical to it....except mine is a Triplex Lever Grip instead of just a dolls head and has lots of choke. My gun is also a pound heavier than that gun.
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,831 Likes: 13
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,831 Likes: 13 |
Check out these Premiers: http://merzantique.com/item.php?id=2864_0_2_49The wood on gun #2 looks all original to me. I'm not so sure about #1 - it looks like it was stocked by someone else. The wood is a little off, too OWD
Last edited by obsessed-with-doubles; 04/22/09 09:20 PM.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
High price for a couple of wore out guns don't ya think ?
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954 Likes: 12
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954 Likes: 12 |
"6 different vendettas" ??? Does the engraver hate birds or what?
OK, seriously. BV3-OQ1-CC2.5 = $12,250 per gun = $24,500/pair.
BV3 = brand name value added by "Scott;" no problem. OQ1 = originally built as best work guns; no problem. CC2.5 = between slight use and significant use; big problem. They both have been rebarreled which suggests serious use or abuse. BV3-OQ1-CC4 = $8,000/gun where CC4 = "heavy use but no abuse." The chipped screw head slots suggest less than best work repairs, too. I'm not comfortable with the wood grade suggested by the photos; it seems like more figured wood was appropriate for the grade of engraving and Scott was well known for selecting high quality and figure wood. Scott was also big on semi-pistol grips (POW), so the straight stocks suggest restocking. Old restock? The blacking level does not match the case hardening color wear, so they have been recently reblacked. The 2 1/2" drop at heel is a bit much for a typical Brit game gun --- restocked and rebarreled for the American market?? BV3-OQ1-CC5 = $6,000/gun where CC5 = minor repairs need or restoration accomplished.
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 11
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 11 |
Daryl,James Charles Scott joined the company in 1855 at age 21. He was trained as an artist at A Design School 1n the U.K.He was the aesthetic leader in the company whilst his brother W.M.Scott was the designer of many of the Scott patents.It is believed that James,s wildfowl designs first appeared on Scott guns during the 1880,s.Undoubtedly a pattern book would have been created for James,s wildfowl designs.Whilst James is said to have carried out some of the engraving, other engravers would have been mandatory to handle the volume of work.These engravers would have been required to work strictly to the pattern book. It was a common practice for engravers to make a "pull"from their finished work. This likely travelled with them and would have provided a source inspiration should they have decided to leave the company.
James Scott became company managing director in 1894. He retired in 1897 when the company amalgamated with Webley and Ellis.
Roy Hebbes
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 11
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 11 |
If you have a copy of the book, "Shotguns and Gunsmiths', by my late friend, Geoffrey Boothroyd; please turn to page 206.On this page you will find a picture of the bar of Scott Premiere #50579 which you will see is for all practical purposes is identical with gun #51289 that is currently offered for sale.
Roy Hebbes
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,588 Likes: 9
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,588 Likes: 9 |
Last edited by Utah Shotgunner; 04/23/09 08:51 AM.
Mike
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,270 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,270 Likes: 201 |
Roy, thanks for the Scott information. I had not known of his involvement in the engraving design. We do see these birds appear on American guns, probably mostly after his retirement date. I'll get out Shotguns and Gunsmiths and read it again. I always find something I missed before.
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,021
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,021 |
I suspect that a lot of Big Names in the gun making trade today and back then, whoever and how many there may be, are deeply grateful that the guns that W&C Scott & Sons built for them over the years was of such outstanding quality. I guess we will never know for sure who or how many there may be.
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