doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Help Identifying proof marks on a French Gun

The soldier isn't at all familiar to me. The lettering on the barrels is still fuzzy, but I think probably a letter got omitted and it should read "Qualite Superieure"--superior quality. Maybe Pierre had one too many glasses of wine at lunch.

Raimey, Kennett published a series of articles on proof in Gun Digest, basically updating Baron Engelhardt's earlier work. The one on French proof comes from Gun Digest, 1970.

Yes partial letters can't be made out. Dose Qualite Depose Super Bure mean Super quality patent bore?

Usually, it's marque deposee--which means that the trademark or name is registered.

It has what looks like depose written above the soldier. It must be the registerd trade mark.

I can't wait to get the stock fixed. I want to try it out. I am going to have a new stock duplicated once I fix the break. I am going to try a few brands such as RST and B&P, and maybe polywad.

That'd be it.

It means dovetailed lump.
"Crochet" is "hook" and is used for lump.
The other wording definitely is a badly stamped "qualite superieure"

When you look at the view of the flats the lines either side of the lug are visible where the underlump is fitted. This view of course does not show whether it is conventional or dovetail, but definitely not chopper lump. A view of the joint under the extractor would show the dovetail joint.

From what I learned here, my poor French, and what I learned on the Darne forum I have listed below. I was told over on the Darne forum that the V with crown is an English mark for reproofing. It looked identical to one I found on the web describing reproofing of guns in England.

Is a dovetail lump a cheap way to finish a gun, or is it just another method with no real disadvantage?

Also found out M&P is a barrel maker who bought out Fanget.

Here are my findings. If anyone sees anything wrong or can help on the unidentified symbols I appreciate the comment.

Lettering on Barrels

1. Qualite Depose Super Bure with knight symbol= Super Quality trademarked Bore (barrel)-The symbol of the knight with shield and sword is the trade mark?

2. Acier Inexplosible= Steel will not blow up.

3. Crochet Encastre= Hook with the base braised into the action block.

4. Canon Fanget= Fanget was the barrel maker

5. Canon De Surete Double Peruffe= Safety Barrels (basically saying barrels were safe to use for construction of the gun)

6. 65= Serial Number

7. G=?

8. 18.4= 12 Bore

9. Double palm leafs and crown repeated twice with the name St Etienne= Double Proofed at St. Etienne

10. M&P = Merley and Pouly “barrel maker who took over Fanget” located in Andrezieux

Lettering on Barrel Flats

11. Choke Rectifie Marsot= Regulated Chokes by Marsot (Company or Builder)

12. Fermeture Integrale= Integral locking mechanism of the action.

13. Portee Garante= Range is Guaranteed. I do not know what the range would be.

14. “SPIROBLOC”= Maybe the type of action?

15. Crown with PT under it= Smokeless Proof using powder T after 1900

16. 65= 2 ½” chamber length

17. Crown with V under it repeated twice= double reproof mark performed in England after it left France.

18. Dragon riding an Arrow= Trade Label of maker possibly? If so who?


Lettering on Trigger Bow
19. Gatimel Marseille= The outfitter who sold the gun in Marseille which still is active.

Here is perhaps the authoritatively correct spelling for what everyone else translated. hon hon hon.

déposé
qualité supérieure
acier inexplosible
St-Etienne

crochet encastré
choke rectifié Marsot
fermeture intégrale
spirobloc
portée garantie

canon de surlie
garanti
double épreuve
canon Fanget

PT and one crown - smokeless proof - Poudre T... T for niTro.

Barrel for canon de surlie and steel for acier inexplosible have something to relate with twist steel, surlie meaning made of twisted strands and inexplosible meaning it will not explode - not that it won't blowup but instead of chattering to pieces it will just bust some seams... oh la la... But this is not a Damascus, is it? I figure with all the markings you have, the guy with the stamps got carried away and used everyone he could find.






Could the logo beneath the 'déposé' be the image of a bird, of a hawk type bug as the brand Fanget is also known as 'épervier' for hawk, and they also used bird related designations for various products. I also want to say they used 'le gaulois' in some situations too. The picture given of the soldier could correspond to that of a Gaul, the round shield and heavy sword correspond, perhaps, if there is also a winged helmet and braided hair, we have a perfect fit. But I am drawing on comic book superhero attire at this point.

An opinion on the V shaped proof mark - I don't really see a vee, I think it is more resembling of the Paris proof mark of a crown above a square-ish shield with the picture of the sail boat... a vee-shaped sail? Oui oui. At least the crossed palm of the St-Etienne proof are well defined.

The 65... Since shells come in dangerous lengths, 65, 67, 70, it's all metric and mysterious, I would find it natural for the gun maker to put that number everywhere as a warning. And serial numbers, essentially, I am not sure French hunters care at all.


Authoritative? It really is only a bunch of loose ideas to google around with, not an expert opinion at all.

Have fun

Thanks SixBears, I can't find how to put the guatle mark on top of the letters.

65 is even etched onto all of the screws and written on the stock, so it had to mean a serial number as well as chamber length. The V is most definatly a V. It has the classic line on top of each line forming the V like a Roman Numeral type V. It is hard to see in the picture but not in hand, however there could be a square around it, but it is hard to see.

The symbol is also definatly a soldier, and not a bird. It is easier to see in person than on the photo. Very hard to take pictures of it.

It does not have damascus barrels.

Thanks for the comments, hopefully I will be able to narrow it down to a time period it was built.