doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Length of Pull

Two cents more thrown into this discussion shouldn't hurt. When I'm trying to help someone determine their proper length of pull I watch them mount their gun (assuming they are starting from a low gun position). If they can't bring their gun to their shoulder without first pushing it away from their body, then the present LOP is too long. We work backwords from there.

Disciplines like American skeet & trap can accomodate a slightly longer LOP because they allow for pre-mounted guns. All FITASC and most game shooting is done with an unmounted gun, and you generally don't have time to suffer with a gun that you can't immediately bring to your shoulder.

Tom Knapp just likes them to go boom boom boom as he don't use the stock half of the time.

Rabbit's posts are always worth listening to.
LOP is, however, very important to me.
I can not imagine how pitch (too much or too little) would have much effect on whether you can hit with the gun or not. As long as you place the comb against your cheek pitch is mainly important only to give the butt maximum contact with your body for recoil reasons. It does not, as the myths say, have a great influence on whether you shoot high or low. If it did, people using the banana pads would shoot their toes off.

IMO, drop (elevation) and cast (windage) must be equal. It is a easy to miss a target to the side as it is to miss above or below. LOP is supposed to get the various body parts in alignment with the stars so they function harmoniously. Fit is to shotguns as sighting-in is to rifles and handguns. The objective is to have a stock that positions the involved body parts such that the gun can be shot more or less reflexively and expected to hit where it points. It should come as no surprise that one set of dimensions is unlikely to fit all guns for all shooting purposes over a shooter's life.

Good post, Hack. Maybe I think so because I agree with everything in it.

I do push mine out and bring it back in even with a normal stock.

I was taught to mount a gun like this and taught it like that for 12 years because all of my students wore a name tag.

I do not see any disadvantage if it is practiced sufficiently.

I do however, practice a lot before the season and regularly shoot old style skeet with my hunting gun.

It's pretty easy with a tight radius pistol grip (or extreme radius like Fred Etchens espoused) to have your wrist nice and relaxed and dominant and able to impart a bit too much control to the aft end. Means sliding the butt strait up and then the muzzles tend to seesaw below the target track. Even with a semi-pistol, let alone strait grip, my wrist is sort of "bound up" or locked. Vertical slide up the body isn't as easy but even if it is, at least it makes the elbow lead to ensure a nice high shoulder pocket. Add a little more LOP and the butt will hang up if you slide, so you do the bayonet thrust first and then back in the pocket and supposedly muzzles don't dip. Hasn't made me a great shooter but that's the theory I subscribe to and the one I try to practise. The Brit gunfitters love that coins on the rib (barrels) trick. I use Susan B. Anthonys.

jack

I'm like Tom Knapp. I don't worry about it. I can shoot just about any gun that is within reason as far as LOP is concerned. In fact, the thing that is more important to me is that I mount and hold the gun the same every time. Since I have started shooting skeet, I try to do this. I wrap my fingers around the front of the forearm in order to keep the gun against my shoulder when I shoot. And in order to mount the gun the same every time, I just touch my nose with my thumb when I mount the gun. This way I have the same sight picture every time.

Like the man said, low gun and "benchrest" (registered American) skeet is different animals. Worse than low gun (which can be just off the cheek, in the armpit) is International which gives good odds of anticipatory movement and timing/mounting mistakes because it's a long way from the vest stripe to the shoulder and the delay doesn't help one little bit.

jack

I spoke to Larry DelGrego last week; he said there are two types of shooters. I forgot the names, but one is the type who pushes the gun away from his body as he brings it up then shoots as the gun comes to his shoulder, and the other is the type who brings the gun directly up to his shoulder and shoots. According to him, the frist type of shooter wil need a longer LOP and is less sensitive to LOP as the second type.