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#633978 08/09/23 09:43 AM
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When I was in Raton for almost 3 weeks this summer, I made a couple of trips to the Shotgun Center on campus. Sitting, almost abandoned, in the entry way with almost no information available was this rather remarkable collection of shotshells. Although I am not a collector or even an accumulator, it was interesting to browse through them. I did a little counting and estimating, I think there a little over 18,000 shells in this collection.

In any event, it might be something you want to check out if you find yourself at the Whittington Center on a rainy day.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

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BrentD, (Professor - just for Stan)

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I have my own collection. I don't have that many, but I have several hundred on shelves surrounding my reloading bench. I pick them up at the local gun club at the Trap range and I have been doing that for about 15 years. I have one Dale Earnhardt 12 gauge empty and a Ted Williams 12 gauge empty when he was working for Sears. Those are about my two rarest shells. I would take a picture of stuff like this but there's no way that I can post them on this website because I can't get my pictures loaded into those websites that you guys use for some reason. I thought about asking someone if I can email the pictures to them so that they can post them for me, but maybe I will do that sometime.

But 18,000!! That's a lot of shells! Thanks for sharing

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Being a cartridge collector I could spend a lot of time looking through that lot. There must be some to fill in gaps in my collection. Lagopus.....

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By the way, where is Raton and The Whittington Center, located? Sounds like a fun experience. Thanks again for sharing!!

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Jimmy, the Whittington Center is a huge (40-50k acres) NRA Shooting facility near Raton, New Mexico (NE corner, just below the Colorado border). I spend 2-3 weeks there, every year, shooting matches and plinking on the side.

If you haven't been there, and you like to shoot, this needs to be up near the very top of your bucket list.


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Last edited by BrentD, Prof; 08/09/23 11:22 AM.

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Originally Posted by lagopus
Being a cartridge collector I could spend a lot of time looking through that lot. There must be some to fill in gaps in my collection. Lagopus.....

There was a disproportionate number of drawers - nearly a whole column of drawers from floor to the top that were labeled "England". You'd enjoy that, I'm sure.


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I will certainly avail myself of this little feature the very next time I'm down there. Thanks for the "heads-up" on this Brent!

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Nice to see that someone has found a sympathetic home for others to enjoy his collection

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Stadt was an IAA member too. There are actually a couple introductory articles by him on shotshells on the IAA website:

https://www.cartridgecollectors.org/?page=introduction-to-collecting-shotshells

https://www.cartridgecollectors.org/?page=collecting-410-shotshells

He also wrote a book:
Stadt, Ronald. 1984. Winchester Shotguns and Shotshells. Armory Press. Tacoma.184p. ISBN: 0960498222

He has a few articles in the IAA Journal too. I can make copies if anyone wants:
Duplex or Duplicity 346/20
Francis E. Boyd Shotshells 438/18
More About J.A.R. Elliot 427/29
Mystery Shotshells 449/8, 453/50
The Winchester Wonder 315/11

and Donating Ammo and Whatever to Museums 487/26 which seems relevant and I'll paste in here:

Quote
Certainly, collector acquaintances should have the opportunity to acquire ammo one plans to liquidate. In the end, other means for fostering ammo collecting may be employed. One of the best ways to promote appreciation of ammo collecting is to contribute to firearms museums. Three internationally-known museums in the USA should be considered.

The most accepting of these is the National Rifle Association, Whittington Center, Raton, NM 87740. Contact Robbie Roberts, Curator at RRoberts@nrawc.org. A few items or a large collection of American and other small arms ammo will likely be accepted, and arrangements may be made for pick up or travel reimbursement.

A second museum is the NRA Museum, located at 11250 Waples Mill Rd., Fairfax, VA 2203. At this writing, space and travel monies are very limited. Ammo displays are especially desired. Contact Doug Wickland at nfmstaff@nrahq.org.

A third museum is the Firearms Museum, Buffalo Bill Historical Society, 720 Sheridan Ave. Cody, Wyoming 82414. Contact Warren Newman, Curator. American ammo is preferred, and travel/transportation reimbursement may be provided.

State/provincial and local museums should also be considered. A museum that displays firearms should also display ammunition. A single round and certainly a box correct in every respect to a firearm stresses the fact that ammo is as important as arms. You will have to be the judge of this because most curators have very limited knowledge of ammo. Imagine a Boyd and Taylor double displayed open with a modern fired shell in one chamber. Imagine further a curator who did not care. Take every opportunity to educate curators, firearms collectors, and others about production, utility, storage, and safety of ammo, boxes, crates, loading tools, etc.

Presently in the USA, Federal taxable income is reduced by 30 percent of the value of contributions to qualified organizations. Obtain the most recent IRS form 8283 and follow directions very carefully. If you plan to make a very large donation, discuss the matter with your accountant long beforehand. If form 8283 and/or your accountant indicate that a formal appraisal is required, it may be necessary to have two appraisers: (1) one experienced in appraising firearms for contributors to museums and (2) an expert regarding the ammo you wish to contribute, serving as a consultant to the former. Curators can identify firearms appraisers who have served contributors, and you can identify collectors or auction house people who are knowledgeable of recent transactions. Appraisals might be based on detailed inventories instead of hands-on examination. Obtain your accountant’s approval of written qualifications of appraisers and inventories before making contributions.

Having made major contributions to two of the museums identified above, I shall be happy to respond to inquiries for further information.


Clock Guns, Pauly Guns, Pinfire Guns and Pinfire Cartridges
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Originally Posted by AaronN
Stadt was an IAA member too. There are actually a couple introductory articles by him on shotshells on the IAA website:

https://www.cartridgecollectors.org/?page=introduction-to-collecting-shotshells

https://www.cartridgecollectors.org/?page=collecting-410-shotshells

He also wrote a book:
Stadt, Ronald. 1984. Winchester Shotguns and Shotshells. Armory Press. Tacoma.184p. ISBN: 0960498222

He has a few articles in the IAA Journal too. I can make copies if anyone wants:
Duplex or Duplicity 346/20
Francis E. Boyd Shotshells 438/18
More About J.A.R. Elliot 427/29
Mystery Shotshells 449/8, 453/50
The Winchester Wonder 315/11

and Donating Ammo and Whatever to Museums 487/26 which seems relevant and I'll paste in here:

Quote
Certainly, collector acquaintances should have the opportunity to acquire ammo one plans to liquidate. In the end, other means for fostering ammo collecting may be employed. One of the best ways to promote appreciation of ammo collecting is to contribute to firearms museums. Three internationally-known museums in the USA should be considered.

The most accepting of these is the National Rifle Association, Whittington Center, Raton, NM 87740. Contact Robbie Roberts, Curator at RRoberts@nrawc.org. A few items or a large collection of American and other small arms ammo will likely be accepted, and arrangements may be made for pick up or travel reimbursement.

A second museum is the NRA Museum, located at 11250 Waples Mill Rd., Fairfax, VA 2203. At this writing, space and travel monies are very limited. Ammo displays are especially desired. Contact Doug Wickland at nfmstaff@nrahq.org.

A third museum is the Firearms Museum, Buffalo Bill Historical Society, 720 Sheridan Ave. Cody, Wyoming 82414. Contact Warren Newman, Curator. American ammo is preferred, and travel/transportation reimbursement may be provided.

State/provincial and local museums should also be considered. A museum that displays firearms should also display ammunition. A single round and certainly a box correct in every respect to a firearm stresses the fact that ammo is as important as arms. You will have to be the judge of this because most curators have very limited knowledge of ammo. Imagine a Boyd and Taylor double displayed open with a modern fired shell in one chamber. Imagine further a curator who did not care. Take every opportunity to educate curators, firearms collectors, and others about production, utility, storage, and safety of ammo, boxes, crates, loading tools, etc.

Presently in the USA, Federal taxable income is reduced by 30 percent of the value of contributions to qualified organizations. Obtain the most recent IRS form 8283 and follow directions very carefully. If you plan to make a very large donation, discuss the matter with your accountant long beforehand. If form 8283 and/or your accountant indicate that a formal appraisal is required, it may be necessary to have two appraisers: (1) one experienced in appraising firearms for contributors to museums and (2) an expert regarding the ammo you wish to contribute, serving as a consultant to the former. Curators can identify firearms appraisers who have served contributors, and you can identify collectors or auction house people who are knowledgeable of recent transactions. Appraisals might be based on detailed inventories instead of hands-on examination. Obtain your accountant’s approval of written qualifications of appraisers and inventories before making contributions.

Having made major contributions to two of the museums identified above, I shall be happy to respond to inquiries for further information.

Thanks for posting this, Aaron. It more or less confirms what I was thinking about why this collection was languishing in the shotgun center at the Whittington Center. The Whitt is currently greatly expanding and renovating their museum, and it was closed to the public while I was there. I'm sure this collection will be in the remodeled museum soon. The old museum was plenty interesting to anyone with even the smallest interest in firearms. I can only imagine what the new version will be like, just another reason to put The Whitt at the top of your bucket list.


_________
BrentD, (Professor - just for Stan)

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]



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