doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Eye-balling stock cast- impossible?

I'm a left-handed wingshot.

I've been looking really hard for a couple years for a 28ga O/U single trigger gun with neutral cast. None appear available new-from-factory in my price point (~ 3.5K).

THREE TIMES I've had sellers tell me their gun had no cast. I questioned them closely, asked them to view the stock from all sides including assembled from the muzzle end, rolling the gun a on a table top, every suggestion I could think of. The latest seller told me he even assessed neutral cast of the stock in a jig.

Two were shipped to me after payment. One I drove hours to view. ALL when I inspected them instead had visible cast-off and/or toe out for a RH wingshot. The one that had been "measured" neutral in a jig was the worst.

What the heck? Am I just encountering "one-eyed" gun sellers? Or are a lot of brains incapable of detecting actual stock cast and thinking thru the distinction "RH vs LH"?

Does anybody know of a reliable source? Please don't tell me to just have a stock bent. I've been to that rodeo where stocks sprung back to original dimensions after a few months.

Frustrated in Montana,
GG

I don't trust anyone, least of all a gun dealer, to correctly measure any stock dimension. Concerning cast, I would have them take photographs from the muzzle end, showing the buttstock from the top and bottom, before sending payment.

The easiest way to see cast - in my opinion is with the gun upside down and looking over the toe. Does the toe, the trigger guard, and the bottom rib align or not?

What works for me is what Brent said, with the addition of putting a couple of known neutral cast guns on either side of it, and stepping back and looking down the length. Variations in cast, especially toe in and out, are readily apparent that way. Also an easy way to measure DAH, by just standing a ruler from the tabletop to the edge of the butt. DAC is a little harder, because you have to view it from the side. I also agree that I've found most reported stock drops are usually 1/8 to 1/4 inch off what I measure.

Clay:

i suspect that just a step or two below the average knowledge level of those who frequent this website, there are relatively few gun folk who even know what cast means....or why it is important....or how to accurately measure it. and, to go a step further, even fewer understand pitch.... and, i will admit that my knowledge regarding some differential between cast measurements taken at both heel & toe is imperfect....some of the competition shooters stocks are "twisted" to a degree that i find quite astonishing....

https://www.gunsinternational.com/g...ock-forend-preowned.cfm?gun_id=101869152

as long as the amount of cast off/on is similar from heel to toe, brent's method, or a photo aligning the topside points (the length of the rib through the breech and top-dead-center of the heel)....can give a pretty good idea of the cast. eightbore has three even better bits of advice....photos from top & bottom....and a minimum of trust. a significant problem with trying to deal with most sellers is that even trying to explain how & why we want such photos taken can be frustrating in its own right.

i have often wished/wondered about sellers who post photos taken with guns resting on some surface that has lines/joints/patterns in the background. with just tiny efforts, it would be possible to align the background lines with the sight plane of the gun...and a couple of those "picture worth a thousand words" would go far in showing some of the things that we try to come to grips with - before we decide to roll the dice. on the other hand....i very much enjoy your photographs and willingness to provide useful information to potential customers.

best regards,

tom

Upside down,,,and looking from the muzzle works best at least for me.
Place the butt on the floor, hold the muzzle with one hand flip the gun upside down. Glance down the upside down bbl(s) from your standing position.

Any intentional or otherwise cast or toe-out/in is instantly visible as you look along the bbls and then onto the trigger guard and down the toe line of the stock..
It's like looking down a piece of lumber. It's either curved or it's straight.

If they say they can't see any,,a simple camera shot will certainly tell one way or the other.

Tie a string around the bead, and run it plumb down the center of the gun to the butt plate. If someone holds the string for you, you can usually measure from the centerline of the butt to the string, and get pretty close. You can run the string around the muzzle and back along the bottom of the gun to accomplish the same thing from the underside of the gun. Cast at heel is almost never the same as cast at toe.
I use string to set the rear wheel in the swing arm of my motorcycles, too. More accurate than you might believe.

Best,
Ted

‘cause it would really suck to have a 360 degree whirlybird tank slapper while you’re BLASTING! to Sheboygan with your FJ buddies for burritos.


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How’s work? lol
(29 Palms is really nice this time of year)

Aboot’ time you put the jug down, and went to bed, ain’t it?

Best,
Ted
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I’m certain 29 Palms beats Detroit, hands down, any time of the year.

Did you ever score a new set of motorized bicycle tires? I could use a new 190 for the FJ, keep
your unemployed eyes open, eh?

It is a right hand world for left handed people. Most only think of cast at the face area but many guns do have some cast in the toe area. It help getting the toe into the proper shoulder area but on left handers it goes in the wrong direction. You might email several makers to see if they make any models without this and go from there. Measuring fine details is beyond most sellers, even those in the business and just about all private sellers. We wont get into the stupid or dishonest ones.