doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com any ideas?

HoJo shows his ignorance again! No Belgian proofs, and Whitworth steel barrels show that this is not JABC.

There are plenty of Birmingham guns out there marked "W Richards". It was a trade name, apparently used by Folsom. It's probable that Folsom started sourcing their guns from Belgium after the 1890 Tariff Act.

I'd say you are correct.

A London address was more desirable. That's why some makers had both London and Birmingham locations, to put London as the address. The proofs usually tell where it was made, but some guns were made in Birmingham and then sent to London to be proofed.

No help, but I believe I would hang that one on the wall.
JR

I have both the Birmingham proofed W Richards as well as a Belgian proofed one. Though both are currently in poor condition the Birmingham proofed one is definitely a few cuts above the Belgian. The Belgian is a top lever gun & is probably a "Newer" gun than the Brit.
Assuming the one with Brit proofs was built by Clabrough it is highly likely they sourced Belgian tubes for the barrels. Most else was more likely done in or around Birmingham. Some fairly low grade stuff was turned out here as well, though not generally as low as the lowest from Belgium.
"London Laminated Steel" is not Whitworth. The pics here as well as my gun appear to be "Plain Twist" certainly not true "Laminated Steel" in the sense of that which had such high rankings in proof tests.

Ken, "W. Richards" was the tradename of William Richards of Preston and Liverpool. He seems to have "done nothing" to discourage the confusion between his name and the "Westley Richards" name. Whether or not he was involved in the use of "W. Richards" by Belgian maker(s) is not, at this time, known. At least, he was unable to stop this use, to his mark's considerable detriment. It appears that he was a maker in the true sense. Likely he bought in work from the trade, as did most (if not all), finished gun makers. W. Richards of Preston/Liverpool (he had shops in both and used both locations) is/should be a well respected name. W. Richards of Belgium is generally low quality.

DDA

There were a few W. Richards listed in London but were long gone before your gun would have been made. William Richards (no relation to Westley Richards) traded at Liverpool and Preston. The name still lives on in Yorkshire http://wrichardsguns.co.uk/history.html and the records are pretty well complete. He will tell you that the business had absolutely nothing to do with spurious guns made in Belgium which were sent to the U.S.A. in large numbers (rarely encountered here in the U.K.). I think they were trying to trade on the more famous Westley Richards. I think you will find that your W. Richards gun, purporting to be made in London, may also be someone trying to trade in the more famous name. Guns by Wm. Moore and Greener were also forged to some degree. Get in touch with W. Richards at the link above and see but I think that it is unlikely to appear in their records. Not to say there is anything wrong with the gun in itself as it no doubt went through the proof house o.k. at some time. Lagopus.....

Lefaucheaux Action W. Richards with Belgian proof



Side lever W. Richards with Birmingham proof



Crescent W. Richards Norwich, Conn.



Louis Muller W. Richards, Belgium



Toplever W. Richards, Birmingham Proof

And they all look like junk....

Miller is correct; the barrels are Twist.

Could the OP please clarify the barrel marks. LP? LLH overstamped with HB?