doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Import Marks on new Aya

Alright, after much research it appears that it is federal regulation that the import name be on top of the barrel for new guns, apparently they can still get away with engraving under the forearm on older guns being imported. I spoke with someone at NECG and she said that they were audited by the ATF some time ago and that they were cited for not being in compliance because they were doing their engraving of new imported aya's under the forearm.

Well....maybe. I know folks who are currently importing AyAs who still mark them under the forearms. Not to go-off on the Feds here, but it seems that it depends on who you actually get to deal with. Some of the BATF folks are fine and some are, evidently, not. We have a President who choses to ignore some laws while selectively enforcing others, that sends a confusing message on down the line for everybody.

When I was importing Darne guns, I was put on notice where the mark would be, what size it would be, what information the marking would contain, and that failure to so mark said guns was a crime. It was to be on the top of the barrels.
There was no discreet option. The Customs people at port of Minneapolis also inspected the gun for BATF markings. And, collected the excise tax on said guns.
Port of Minneapolis is an unfriendly place to import firearms to. Trust me on that.
Unless the law has changed, the stuff has to be engraved or stamped on top of the tubes.
I had two guns sneak through without it. I wish none of them had been marked, but,
it wasn't my call.

Best,
Ted

The days of discreet marking is over.
Some agents/locations just haven't gotten the word yet.

Be glad they don't require the dot matrix punch marking that milsurps are now required to use.

Could very well be that the law has changed, but unless it has, anyone with an FFL can do "occasional" importations. It was my understanding--which may be wrong, or the law may have changed--that while those with an import license have to mark their guns, those with just your common, garden variety FFL doing the occasional importation do not.

I have a British 20, clearly imported as a used gun. (It predates the ATF by several decades.) The importer's mark is on the underside of the rib, nicely hidden by the forend. I've seen numerous other guns, imported used, that are similarly marked. Still acceptable? On new guns, my understanding is the same as GrouseGunner's.

The law has not 'changed' per se. The ATF has re-interpreted the standard.
Mostly it came about due to milsurps and black rifles, but has no exemptions for 'fine' guns.

If your 20 predates the ATF and GCA '68, the importers mark was done by choice. It was not required before that point.

Individual FFL's can do an occasional import. I have done exactly one. One was enough. I did the one to learn the process and to see if it was a direction I would want to pursue. Nope.


Here is the kind of marking now being done on milsurps. Even if the gun already has a factory serial number, the ATF is now requiring a new one, marked to meet the reinterpreted standard.




Marking Requirements
Licensed Importer � 18 U.S.C. � 923(i) and 27 CFR � 478.92
26 U.S.C. � 5842 and 27 CFR � 479.102
1. SERIAL NUMBER
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame or
receiver
�
The serial number cannot duplicate the serial number appearing on any other firearm the
importer previously imported
�
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the serial number must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch and in a print
size no smaller than 1/16 inch
�
2. NAME of MANUFACTURER
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame,
receiver, barrel or slide
�
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the serial number must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch
�
3. COUNTRY of ORIGIN
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame,
receiver, barrel or slide
�
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the country of origin must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch
�
4. MODEL DESIGNATION (If assigned)
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame,
receiver, barrel or slide
�
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the model designation must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch
�
5. CALIBER OR GAUGE
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame,
receiver, barrel or slide
�
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the caliber or gauge must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch
�
6. NAME of IMPORTER
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame,
receiver, barrel or slide
�
Firearms Verification - Gun Control Act Definitions 2
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the importer�s name must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch
7. CITY & STATE of the IMPORTER
Must be conspicuously engraved, cast or stamped (impressed) on the firearm frame,
receiver, barrel or slide
�
For firearms imported after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting or stamping
(impressing) of the importer�s city and state must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch

Right. I realize no importers mark was required before 1968. My point was that the gun in question, while pre-68, was likely imported post-68 given the presence of the concealed mark.

I used the services of a dealer who was not an importer to import one gun. Went smoothly in our case, but that was also some time ago and I don't know that I'd recommend anyone else--dealer without an import license or buyer using the services of a dealer who's not an importer--go that route either.

Even if you are a regular dealer (01) you are required to mark the gun, those who did not did not follow the law. An 01 dealer is not exempt


John Boyd
Quality Arms
Houston, TX

If I was going to have a early 1900's English sidelock brought in from England would it be the same requirement? I would not even consider importing one if that was the case.

Yes. You have to mark all guns imported with the information exactly as above. Note the only thing that changes is the date of the import, NOT the date of manufacture of the firearm. I've never understood how someone can look at the regs posted above, in the language BATF uses, and think that somehow, it doesn't apply to the gun they want to import, or them.
As to 01 FFLs doing imports. Some of my most memorable cases involved getting people out of a jam when an import went bad at the 01 FFL level. They are supposed to be able to do it, and if everything goes right, they can. But, the most common problem was a gun catching an airplane to the wrong town, at which point, US Customs seizes the gun, as, it isn't supposed to be on that plane. At that point, you need an importer, and he may need a customs house broker.
Just off the cuff, my experience, at the time BATF was interested in the business and agents were there to help. US Customs was an enormous fiefdom, staffed with a lot of people who couldn't make it as real cops for some reason, and took that chip on their shoulder to work with them everyday. I never had a single problem with BATF. The people at US Customs often made trouble for no particular reason, other, than they could.
I don't do it anymore. Maybe things have changed, or, the political climate where you are located will be different. But, I'm done importing anything, especially guns.

Best,
Ted