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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 534
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 534 |
Well, the issue is that the "real" Francotte still makes guns (very few, very high end guns, usually sidelock double rifles). So in my opinion, this is a different problem.
WC-
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 416
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 416 |
Been looking forward to this thread...
Always looking for small bore Francotte SxS shotguns.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,553
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,553 |
I got a Gazalogue from them & was very surprised to see the Francotte guns there.
I thought Francotte were gone, had a small comeback, & were then gone for good....but I see now they have a site here on doublegunshop....
But for me , a "proper" Francotte would have to have VL&D on the bbls..& also the word Belgium...otherwise there is no history
franc
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 297 Likes: 3
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 297 Likes: 3 |
I am surprised this is not the first time that a "Francotte" gun come to live again. If I good remember we have spoken about "Francotte" in the past and there was a member John Foster I think who told us that one of his friends make high grade Francotte guns in The Netherlands, I expected that he could show us the final product but we never have seen one.
Because I live in Belgium and I wanted to know the final truth and this truth is available in Liége (Chambre de commerce) They told me that the name "Francotte" could not be used on any NEW made gun, what is possible is that some of the semi finished guns who had the the name Francotte on it are finished now.Or maybe I am wrong again and John Foster can clear this definitively out for all of us.
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,174
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,174 |
The price of $40K seems insane to me considering the engraving appears to be the same laser-cut scroll found on the A-10.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,373 Likes: 6
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,373 Likes: 6 |
I had the exact same reaction - even taking into account that it appears to be a scaled action .410, that price seems off by a multiple of 2-3. But CSMC's pricing is typically a bit "optimistic"
Such a long, long time to be gone, and a short time to be there.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105 |
Francottes have always been pricey, comparatively speaking. At least as new guns. There was a time when they were "sleepers" on the used market, but not so much now as used to be the case. Back in 1936, Abercrombie advertised a Knockabout Ejector at $175, which was about $10 cheaper than a Parker DHE, about $60 more than a Fox CE or Elsie Specialty, $10 cheaper than an Ithaca 4E, $17 more than a Pigeon Grade Superposed.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
I am surprised this is not the first time that a "Francotte" gun come to live again. If I good remember we have spoken about "Francotte" in the past and there was a member John Foster I think who told us that one of his friends make high grade Francotte guns in The Netherlands, I expected that he could show us the final product but we never have seen one.
Because I live in Belgium and I wanted to know the final truth and this truth is available in Liége (Chambre de commerce) They told me that the name "Francotte" could not be used on any NEW made gun, what is possible is that some of the semi finished guns who had the the name Francotte on it are finished now.Or maybe I am wrong again and John Foster can clear this definitively out for all of us. Marc, I agree. I would like to hear about this project as well. Pete
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,133 Likes: 198
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,133 Likes: 198 |
In my opinion, Abercrombie and Fitch killed the market for new Francottes by overpricing them. In about 1961, when I was young and curious, rooting through the gun room at A&F in New York, I was surprised to see Knockabouts offered at $425, with 28 and .410 at $485. I love a good Knockabout, but those prices would buy a much better grade of gun in 1961, like a Grade 3 Superposed. It would be interesting for Bob Beach to tell us how much A&F was paying for a Knockabout in 1961.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105 |
Eightbore, according to Schwing's book, a Pigeon (Grade II) Lightning 12 went for $450 in 1961. Pointer (Greade III) was $560. But the general inflation in prices of guns from Belgium caused A&F to switch to the Zoli-Rizzinis as their real "knockabout" sxs, although they continued to import Francottes as well. Same story with FN, which caused Browning to start importing Miroku-made doubles a decade or so later.
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