doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Fox 16 gauge choke measurements

What is the range of actual factory choke measurements, ie. (.6xx) for chokes in a Fox A 16 gauge?
IC choke measurements range from=.6xx-.6xx, Mod.=.6xx-.6xx, IM=.6xx-.6xx and Full=.6xx-.6xx.
It seems that different manufacturers bore to different sizes, therefore a one-size-fits-all chart for all 16 gauge guns by all makers doesn't always work.
Thanks in advance!

Mark, for what it's worth, I messaged the following on determining chokes to Dave Miles yesterday on the Parker site:

"I'm trying to get my synapses in line, Dave, to remember where I read about .650 bores in older 16 gauges. My gunsmith felt there wasn't sufficient thickness to open my F/F 1914 Sauer to C/IC. Turned out those bores were .650 and the Sauer now paterns perfect C/IC.

"I erred in my message at midnight last night by confusing the circumstances of the too-tight Sauer with what I thought were the chokes of my 16 gauge hammer 0 frame 1889 Parker, and the PGCA letter confirming what it is: C/F not M/F.

"I refuse on principle to put the error down to old age! It shows, however, that the determinative of choke is the patterning board. (Note JOC's Shotgun Book provides 16 gauge Inner Bore Diameters of .665, .673 and .664 of Browning, Remington and Winchester respectively.)"

Mark, as noted above, O'Connor gave those figures for Browning, Remington, and Winchester, but not for Fox. (And I suppose it's possible they would have changed, from the Philly Fox days to Savage ownership.)

For what it's worth, my records on a couple 16ga Sterlingworths I've owned show bores at .651 on a Savage gun, .655 on a Philly gun. They didn't mark choke designations, so the constrictions I found on mine would not do you much good--other than to note that what had to have been full was REALLY full by 16ga standards. Constriction in the L barrel of those two guns ran .032 and .034.

I may be misremembering, but I don't recall that McIntosh's book on Fox included figures such as factory bore diameters and choke constrictions.

Factory bore diameters and choke constrictions would be helpful.

Mark,
I cannot help with bore and choke constrictions. If you are trying to determine if the chokes are original, fox chokes are usually around 4" long and are tapered having no parallel section. Hope that helps.
Steve

So if the chokes are .025 and .038 I can assume that they are originally tight-modified and tight-full assuming that the bores have not been opened creating tighter chokes. But could they equally be .015 and .025 and still be Mod. and Full per Foxes original boring? What I'm trying to find out is what is the allowable "range" that Fox might have used in a 16 gauge.

Mark,
I don't know about Fox guns, I do know about L.C. Smiths. From the begining production of the 16 ga it was chambered 2 9/16" and the bores were .650. From a record sheet of June 3, 1936 chambers were still 2 9/16" but bores were then .662. Some say the chambers were changed close to then also but I have a 1939 still with 2 9/16" chambers.
The only real way to tell is to use a gage like Skeet's that lets you go into the bores 12". I don't know what their 16 ga. ring is set at, but after zeroing the dial to that ring, inserting it in barrel and withdrawing slowly reading dial will give you the amount of contriction.

Mark, are you sure your on the right site,parkerites are the only ones interested in insignificant minutae.

David, he keeps asking about fox guns L.C. data is irrelevant.

cheery bomb,
You are right, I was just trying to give him a comparison, as most manufactures were close to each other in bores.

Just sold my last 16 gauge Fox. Now I'll be trying to buy it back. When I get it back, I'll let you know what it measures.