I can't tell from the pictures if the stock being copied is a wooden one or something else. My question, if the stock being copied is wood is in injured in anyway? Does the pantograph (sp?) leave any marks?
The stock being copied is a pattern, that was copied and modified from a Brno602 stock on a 375 H&H: Cheeck piece added, length of pull added and a little more drop. And I put in 3/8" cast off. This pattern stock has been painted with a high strength black polyurethane paint for a slick, tough surface for the stylus to run over.
The stock being carved will be another pattern stock, with a change to the grip: Grip lengthened and moved back, a few changes in the cheek piece, and more wood all around. This stock will be inletted for the Mauser actions. Actually, I have completed it and will make a longer post later today showing the details and an explanation of what I am doing. This wood is Maple, makes a good pattern wood as it is harder than walnut.
The stylus doesn't damage the wood in any way on the pattern, but will put rub marks in a nice oil finish.
If I am tracing an existing stock, I use a teflon stylus and wax the stock, this prevents marking. The butt plate/pad must be removed, and I screw a dowel down into the front of the barrel channel to have something for the front spindle of the duplicator to grab.
I have several barreled actions to stock, so I am making a pattern in each style that I need, with my dimensions. After the patterns are completed I will carve the final stocks. Most of the rifles are big bores, with sights, so the stocks will have the correct drop and cast off, and I will extend the grips back for the high recoil guns, this keeps from bruising the fingers behind the guard. Most big bore stocks are made incorrectly, especially factory stocks.
The advantage to owning a duplicator is I can change stock dimensions by the setup in the machine, cutter selection vs stylus size, and cutter depth setting. Opens up a whole new world in stockmaking!
When I ordered your book, this is why I asked you about stock dimensions. In a couple of weeks I will start on a 500 Jeffery, and I will be styling the stock very similar to Schuler's original stocks. And I plan on copying some of the stock lines in your book. I have Whelen's full scale drawing, so I will be making a stock to his dimensions also.
Most big bore stocks are made incorrectly, especially factory stocks.
Amen, brother! Absolutely the worst of the rifles with great reps is the pre-64 M70 458. I've built some light 458s, lighter than the M70, but the first M70 458 I ever shot convinced me that it would also be the LAST! The 375 is almost as bad and the bolt knob smacks my big fat index finger 'cause my hand is crowded by the grip. BAH!
Thanks for the informative post!
Regards, Joe
Yep, I had a M70 338 push feed with a tiny short pull stock. After 3 rounds, my trigger finger was cut by the bolt handle and I had a cut on my cheek from the cheek piece. Absolutely the worst stock design I had ever used!!! And the 338 does not have a lot of recoil.
I will have photos up later today.
So stocks on big boomers should have a more open pistol grip so the hand can be to the rear and the index finger is stretched forward?
Have a picture of a proper grip?
Is this too short?
That is a good one, nice grip. I like a little more distance on my stocks. The Original Schulers had the grip a little more to the rear and less curve. The photo stock also has some drop at the heel and comb. Probable has cast off if it was made by an experienced big bore guy.
The key is to fit the grip to the shooters hand. This is where a nice selection of pattern stocks is handy, just stick the barreled action in a stock and head to the range. Then back to the duplicator and make a few changes.
One of my ambitions is to build a big bore "try" stock so it may be adjusted at the range to fit the shooter. Then measure everything and start carving.
Thanks to you for sharing your thoughts and experience on stocks and stock making.
I have a different model duplicator by the same manufacturer as yours. Do you have an email address you wouldn't mind sharing with me so we might carry on some more lengthy discussions off the bbs? You can respond directly to me at kinglarr@knology.net
here is one I ran today.....only my second and I can see this is going to be like most things in gunsmithing....it is going to take some practice to get good at.
You are doing great, I have only ran 6 stocks across mine.
The tricks: Sharp cutters, cut flat only (horizontal), small rotations of the stocks. Rough out at least 0.100" oversize first, then go back and finish carve.
I will start another post in a few minutes with "The Rest Of The Story" on my duplicator photos, it has some tips for success.
Actually it will be two threads:
1. Making a pattern stock
2. Duplicator setup.
ChiefShotguns, email sent.
Steve B, who made the duplicator? I would love to see a full photo.
Patterns, Patterns. The things grow like weeds. I have a stock maker friend that has over 700. Sadly he does not make stocks any more. So all the patterns are in storage, time for me to go through them and look for the "right stuff".
The duplicator was made by Mike Greene
http://www.riflebuilders.com/Pictures of the whole machine on Monday.
I thought it was a Greene, I used one around 10 years ago. Gave me the bug to find a machine for myself.
