Refinishing a pre '64 Winchester 94. I know the nickel steel may be part of the problem, but it doesn't seem likely due to results. Barrel came out flawless, receiver is the problem. It is now nicely blued, but has streak that I can't get rid of. I had it totally blued once, but, because of streaks, I resanded and started over. I'm now at the same point. For information, I am degreasing with denatured alcohol after each carding. I am using Laurel Mountain Barrel Brown solution. I will mention that this is not my first attempt at rust bluing, as I have done at least 50 mixed rifles, shotguns, and handguns by this method. It is driving me crazy, so any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

Where is the streak? it is possible oil is migrating out of the barrel threads. If that's where it is use a heat gun on the joint till no oil is seen.

Nope, streaks on both sides of reciver, flat area. I'm sure no oil got on it, and I have degreased with denatured alcohol after carding each time.

treeman,
I like acetone better than alcohol for degreasing. If you think the problem is oil, you might try applying the solution with 0000 steel wool( degrease the steel wool with acetone first). If you card with a wire wheel that has been used for something else, degrease it with acetone also. None of that may work but worth a try. BTW be sure you have even coverage with the solution.
Mike

There is one sure way of removing oil or grease from metal, I have never found it to ever fail. Though you must be extremely careful using it because in high concentrations it can produce serious Caustic burns extremely quickly.
The use of a very strong warm solution of Sodium Hydroxide more commonly named Caustic soda, this is not to be confused with Sodium Carbonate common name Washing Soda. This Caustic Soda mixture saponifies oil and grease that can sometimes be difficult to remove using Alcohol or Petroleum spirits from metals.

Have had pretty good luck boiling parts in paint store Tri-Sodium Phosphate (TSP). Rinse well.
Not as nasty as Sodium Hydroxide (Lye).
Chuck

I've always used alcohol and never had a problem. I don't think it's an oil residue problem, and think it has to do with the nickel steel. I was hoping someone had experience with the pre 64 Winchester receivers.

Brownell's Gunsmith's Kinks shows several solutions to the problem, but I don't think any are for rust blueing.

Winchester 1894 receivers are not made of nickel steel, you're doing something wrong.

I degrease using TSP in a crock pot, crank it on high and let it sit for a couple of hours.

OBTW, Winchester receivers were not rust blued, they were charcoal, Carbonia or Du-Lite blued depending on period of manufacture.

Respectfully

Mike

You may be seeing forging lines in the metal. Dark streaks that appear from that process usually on the earlier made frames. I don't know what the technical term for them is. But they show up on the Winchester L/A and others.


There should be no need to 'degrease' with the alcohol after every carding. It's either clean or it's not when you start.
If you are dragging oil or grease onto the surface by way of a contaminated carding wheel or even some how contaminated application swab,,clean up that situation and leave the clean metal alone.
The more you fiddle with the surfaces you are trying to blue, the more chance there is of introducing something to spoil the bluing.

Another thing to check is the blue soln itself.
LMF is good stuff. But NEVER wet your swab out of the main bottle and NEVER pour any unused soln from a job back into it.
Pour a small amt to be used for a job out into a separate container and work from that.
Any contamination will be kept there and not spread to the entire bottle. Not pouring unused soln back in saves the main bottle from the same fate.

It keeps you from accidently tipping the man bottle over while working with it too and losing most of it on the bench.
A screw cap plastic med bottle works well for keeping the smaller amt.
I still keep the left over from a job in that pill bottle and use it to blue screws and pins if I need too but never for a 'job'. More often I use the Express Blue left over for the small screw and pin stuff anyway.

Check what you are using for an application swab too.
Some fabics have a softner, fresh scent or sizing washed into them and that can blend with the bluing soln as you are applying it and cause streaks.
Even old shirt material that's 'washed out' still has been laundered and that last cleaning means laundry soap of some kind. They all have softeners, scent and pretty stuff in them and that stays in the fabric.
Paper toweling bits can do the same thing.

A small flat plain soft paint brush works well for application. Squeeze out most of the soln so you don't get runs and it goes on nice and even.

Second the check the solution. I had a set of barrels that gave me fits. I've always poured into a separate container. Switched to a new bottle of blue and the barrels went black immediately. I think the 3/4 empty bottle just went bad from either time or atmosphere.

A related question for the adept on a post war Win M12 proof steel barrel with solid rib that was rust blued possibly by Simmons and has developed a plum color cast. Can this barrel be degreased and re rust blued without polishing, in other words doing more applications, carding etc. on the existing bluing? Thank you for replies.

Probably. The solid ribs were soft soldered on at the factory and were rust blued. If you see the proof mark to the side of the rib it is factory original.

Scuff the bbl down with something like scotchbrite to cut through the finish that's on it now.
You don't have to take it to sparkling brite white new look polish. Just remove the reddish color of the old blue job and even up the surface color to a gray tone.
The new rust blue will take nicely to that surface prep and you won't be battling any of the old plum color underneath it.
The scotchbrite will polish up a bbl very easily too.
I use the maroon and grey color pads a lot. They blend in regular grit cloth polishing nicely too.
I don't remember what grit polish they represent. The maroon is coarser IIRC.

**The reddish look to the nickel steel bbls is usually a sign of a bad hot salt (re)blue job. Bad temp control, depleted salts, ect.

Though the factory method to blue the solid rib bbl was to rust blue it because of the soft soldered rib installation, who knows what has been done to these guns in their many years of history since.
Simmons rust blued them too AFAIK in their installs both aftermarket and for the factory.

Worth a careful check of the rib itself and it's solder joint along the bbl for any weak detached spots from a hot salt blue sometime in it's life. Easy enough to fix it now and then do a nice reblue job.