Just for the fun of it, what shotguns, rifles, handguns and cartridges would you place in the "cult" catagory?

I'm not sure how to discribe "cult", but IMO its guns that are no longer made, that are sought after to be used and not just collected.

I'm asking this question on some of the other boards.

Since I am a Model 21 Winchester guy (5 of them) I would have to say 21s but that is my bias. Certainly the English, Parkers, and LC Smiths are there too. But as I am a rather large guy 21s are my cult. HuntersDad

I visited engraver Ken Hurst yesterday and saw what cult guns really are. His clients are taking advantage of his past claim to fame as Winchester factory engraver of the last of the Super-X Model 1. His recent commissions exceed all factory examples, but only a hard core "Cult Gun" originally offered for a couple of hundred bucks retail can support the addition of thousands of dollars of fine engraving and inlay work. My vote is for the Super-X.

Good choise, Bill.

hd, all 21s a considered collectable. Only certain versions are cult.

I can see already on all the boards that most folks are confusing "cult guns" with "collectable guns".

"Cult Guns" are the S&W Model 29 of Dirty Harry fame and the Winchester 73 of the Jimmy Stewart movie of that title.

Remington model 600s. Nylon 66 Remington 22s. Original lever break H&R single's. Charlin's.
Ahlman's did a crackerjack business converting worn out Remington 742 auto highpower rifles into pumps a few years past, if you have a Remington pump deer rifle that the front wood doesn't match the back wood, you have a cult gun by default.
Best,
Ted

Cult guns become collectibles because there are so many "want to be's" in this world. Some thing like 90% of the .458s made have never been to Africa. The 44 mags have a cult following that you can trace back to the Dirty Harry movies.

Here are a few more guns for your list.

Automag.
Model 12
cowboy shotguns with hammers and bobbed barrels.
Military guns like the M1, 30 Cal. Carbine and AK's.
Anything with Winchester on the side except Model 24's. Never heard a cult based on ugly.
Darnes and the look a likes.
Snobs with any "British game guns"

Well, there's always the "Cult .45", 1911 or 1873. -- Ed

I do think that Bill Murphy did a good job of defining the characteristics of a cult gun on another board, one which has a bit of a rabid, yet nonetheless relatively small, dedicated following, said following resulting in prices that are rising faster than guns in general as the gun develops its cult (that it didn't have originally), and usually has some unique characteristic that endears it to its followers (and often is derided by others), tend to not be ubiquitous, and often has some interesting history to debate.

I do again nominate the Winchester SX-1 for this category (in this Bill and I agree).

- Those who love this gun (myself included) are passionate about it (to the extent of pouring ridiculous money into engraving, restocking, etc...oh, my aching bank account LOL)
- Prices have rapidly increased in the last few years
- To those who love this gun, its a bank vault solid hunk of machined steel, still reflects the tooled steel manufacturer of by gone years (no stamped 1100 parts here), and screams "last of the classic Winchesters". To others it's a rail road tie of an automatic (their loss )
- quanties made are relatively small (compared to 1100 or 3XX series Beretta autos)and given its out of production status its probably not the auto a new shooter would try to buy and maintain
- Most of the records are lost adding to some mystery about date of manf and config differences, etc.

I sill shortly have one of the most expensive SX-1s probably ever made...and I can't justify it other than by my love for this gun and a desire to bring one to its ultimate state and honor the Win tradition.

Charlins redoux!

Parker's...they have their own forum.

Would a gun lose it's cult status after a Repro is issued? Once the cult is recognized as a profit source, does it become a mainstream collectable?

Abbreviated Repro List
Win
M 12
M 21
M 42
M 1885
LC Smith (if you consider the Marlin thing a repro)
Fox
Parker
1911
NID
Colt SAA

What abOut UZI's ?

I'd say that perhaps any pre '64 Model 70 Winchester used as a shooter, but particularly any chambered for the .270 Winchester may be the best modern candidate, using Don's criteria. Next might be the model 12, in any iteration. I would have added the model 37 Ithacas, particularly the 20's & Featherweights, but I guess they are techincally still being made, so will say that Ted's Remington model 17 fits, its just a smaller cult;-)

'Cult' by one def is: "an instance of an almost religous veneration of a .. thing, esp. as manifested by a body of
admirers.

Lowell must own a cult gun....

because he has a religious follower.....Lord wOpert.

The black rifle.
PPC or any cartridge based off the 220 Russian brass.
50 BMG
Ackley Imp cartridges.
short magnum
Black powder shot shell

Winchester 88 or Browning .22 auto's

Gooser

Browning Sweet Sixteen
Sixteen Gauge Guns in general
30-30 Caliber Lever Guns
Browning A-5's in general
Ithaca "Deerslayer" (for those areas requiring shotgun only)

Savage 220A (Had to add this one as Dad swore by it more than he swore at it.

Sigs chambered in 5.7 x 28. Now that's a cult firearm if there ever was one!! It is IMO a solution in search of a problem.
Jim

I think in order to officialy be a CULT gun...the gun has to be a gun of a collectable nature [model 12 Winchester], but of a configuration that was not highly sought after when it was offered...say 32in solid rib Duck gun...Now days model 12 collectors give these examples cult gun status with there drooling and slobbering when trying to obtain one of these from an unsuspecting seller....it is about impossible for them to give a lowball offer without shakeing and breaking into a sweat along with the formentioned oral maladies!........

Way too general.

TW, a Model 70in 270 is way too common.

Well, Don, a cult gun HAS to be at least common enough for a cult to form around it.
TW said the Remington 17-but, JMHO, there aren't enough of them around for it to truly be a cult gun. If there aren't enough examples for the cult to worship, it becomes a "siren" gun-one you can't, or won't own.

Maybe a 17 isn't a good example of that, but, a Fabbri might be.

I also question the out of production part-The Thompson center single shot pistols have a well developed cult, and are still very much in production. The other aspect of cult following is something not everyone wants to be a part of. I don't have/need/want a Thompson center, or half a dozen different barrels for one. But, those centerfire single shot pistol guys are indeed a cult if ever there was one.
Best,
Ted

Ted, you may be right about the TC SS, but not a cult for me.
As to the M17, yes rare, but there's not a real under ground cult following.

Not a cult gun but you do have the 16 and 28 gauge cults. A heck of a lot of guns are bought just because of the ga. not for what they are.

Even tho the 17 isn't considered a cult gun, I own one for no other reason than it is a slick 20 ga. & I didn't have one. That being said, my 17 is a non ribbed bbl & I'm looking to buy a bbl with rib. Anyone have one for sale ?? I'd like to re-stock it with a great stick & engrave it up for myself IF, I could get a bbl with rib. Ken

Pre-64 Model 70
Model 12
Model 21
A-5 in general, and sweet sixteen in particular

Remington 31s
S&W 41s
Daly 500 SxS's

Don,
That list I exclude from cult status. A special M12, 70 or 21 is going to click with 99.9% of us as a collectable gun.

It's your thread, but IMO a cult gun has to be somewhat ignored by the collector community and raise the eyebrows of us hoi polloi when mentioned as special. The Super X is a good example.

Thompson SubMachine gun. Known by dozens of different nicknames, instantly recognizable by most everyone in the last 7 decades or so, even those not 'in to guns', too late to make it's intended debute in WW1, languished unwanted till the USPO, of all people, made the first gov't purchase of them. Used by every branch of our armed forces and just about every other govt around the world (free world and otherwise), Law Enforcement, outlaws, ranchers, farmers, gangsters, security, and just plain gun owners. Still in use, extremely collectible and expensive as all hell.

I have a couple of Remington Model 32s. I think they are cult guns. And, I think we here are raising the Lefevers to cult status. No? Jake

Jon, you are right, 28 and 16 gauge qualify. If you read my question, I did include cartridges as a catagory.

Don't tell Recoil Rob his 17s aren't cult guns. As I lurk around the net, I am surprised at how many people own one, and how many more want one.

But, there aren't all that many of them. I own one that I just picked up a second barrel for that should be gone over by someone like Ken.

Maybe someday.
Best,
Ted

I have to agree with Ted that the Remington Nylon 22 is a cult rifle. I am definitely a member of that cult. Owners of these rifle are not numerous and we go to great lengths to find that great, pristine and rare example. The Trail Rider is the only lever 22 that Remington built.
As the molds for the stocks were sold and then worn out in Brazil, there will be no more.
I am pleased that I have more than a dozen and still looking to add to my cult collection.:}
Best,
John
PS---Yep. I know that I did not mention Lindner.LOL

I've thought long and hard...I say it's the SxS Hammer gun.

In addition to the above...
Martini-Henrys languished unwanted in sheds, armouries and other obscure places across Britain and the former empire until the film "Zulu" was made in the 1960s.
They became quite sought after following that moment.
It's little brother, the BSA martini model 4b .310 followed as a natty little companion piece.
For what they are (simply built, no-nonsense miltary rifles and trainers) they have become very valuable.
RG

Joe:
Your hammer gun post caused me to think. Perhaps you are correct, although may need a bit of extension. Pin fires have to be cult type of guns. I know three guys that only buy them. Shells now being available, they shoot them as well.
Then we have Damascus guns. I, among others, will sooner own a fine Damascus barreled gun than a steel barreled one of the same period.
These thoughts may take us further afield than Don intended, though.
I wonder if our friend Phail, the guru of rare American makers of the 19th century, is the Chief Cult Leader of guys that treasure these guns above all else?
Best,
John

No, Vector still manufactures SA versions for the public. New FA versions, albeit post-sample, can still be had for little more than SA counterparts. Collector driven appreciation of virtually all transferrable FA guns is merely an artifact of an '86 law.

My kids love to shoot them, particularly with a .22 kit installed. Recreational use will carry on, but the open bolt sub-gun platform is dated. Germany and the IDF have moved on.

Sam

Pre 1944 P38 Lugar ....... Walther P38 and PPK

Al

John
Never thought of being in a Cult-Just thought I was addicted.
My wife says I'm crazy and obsessed-My Sisters says that if
lost all the money in my guns I would still have had my money's
worth. -Oviously both are right.
Bill McPhail

410 Parkers!

These are collector guns, not cult.

Bill:
As all married men know, wives think of husbands either as little boys or deranged men most of the time.
The one button that my late wife could push that had me steaming was to tell me to grow up when I disagreed with her.LOL
I can agree with your sisters. Wise and astute women. Course, they do not have to live with you anymore.LOL
Best,
John

Winchester Model 59s ?

Al - I would agree with these.

Bingo! The 59 is about as 'cult' as one can get.

The Benelli guns were 'cult' for a while... until discovered by the masses...

Some of the single barrel trap guns certainly fall into the 'cult' category... Ljutic, Seitz.

Man. I'm surprised how many cult guns I own or have owned. I never owned a Win 59 or a Ljutic but I've owned several Remington 17's, TC pistols and A-5's. The Model 12's speak for themselves.

CRF Model 70 chambered for .375 Belted Rimless Magnum Nitro-Express Holland.

Pistol: Mauser C.96 (broomhandle)
Revolver: Colt SAA
Rifle: Mannlicher-Schoenauer
Shotgun: Ferlach hammer (at least here in Slovenia)

Regards,
Jani

I nominate the Iver Johnson .410 Skeeter. No other gauge Iver Skeeter attracts much interest or money, but the .410 has a passionate, but limited following that drives up the prices. Limited numbers, but not rare. You have to be a cult member to pay a premium price for a plain, small gauge skeet gun.

DGM:
I do agree. Isn't it wild that the Johnson 410 can bring $350/400 and with a tad of embellishment and configuration bring 3/4/5 times its plainer cousin?
Just has to be in Don's ballpark.
Best,
John

Well, this whole thing is out of hand at this point.

BTW, the Iver Johnson Skeeter(whatever guage) would fit the bill.

While many of the guns noted are interesting and certainly collectible in their own right I don't consider most of them cult guns. To me anyway a Cult gun is something outside of mainstream collecting. I would certainly put the Dardick Automatic Revolver and its associated Tround ammunition in that category. Another would be the Gyrojet pistol of the same era. An older example would be a Chicago Palm pistol.
Jim