Why have and does the gun community insist on saying "Aya" for AyA, which is the abbreviation for Aguirre and Aranzabal? Some even go so far as to say "A Y A". Huh?
JR

better than pos...

It actually would be >>Ah e Ah<<

Serbus,

Raimey
rse

Xxx

People don't know what the AYA means. Maybe the guns that are sold here in the USA should be marked A&A?

The Darne guy chuckles. Welcome to my neighborhood.

Best,
Ted

_____________________________________________________________________________
Not “Darnay”.

English abbreviations, of Spanish names and words does not translate well. AyA, A and A, or whatever you want to call them have sold more double guns than anybody else I think. I have read over 600,000 so far according to Holts. Everything from lowest field grade, non ejector to decent knockoffs of H&H side plates, with everything in between. Plus a decent knock off O/U.

Their cheap box locks was the final blow to the English gun trade for domestic box lock production. Their made to order side plates were cheaper than the used H&H market. They even made a ton of 25” guns. So no major part of the trade was not covered. Perhaps the only market they did not exploit was the very high end and that market is name driven, extremely high quality and very small.

But in the US all we saw for years were the lowest grades so our opinion of them has suffered. I have a number of model 4 in several gauges. They all give good service, are a joy to shoot and carry and did not break the bank. AyA owners mostly don’t care how you spell their name. They work, don’t need much maintenance and are still undervalued.

It's because we're Americans. We're jingoistic, ethnocentric and because we are the biggest market for everything in the world, we get to do it our way (or, at least we have until now). What's wrong with that?

I sold them for over 10 years and called them AyAs, even knowing what the translation was. If a client asked about the meaning of name I would happily explain it for them and then we would go right back to callen them AyAs. Nobody over in Spain ever complained about it that I ever heard of. They were just happy to see them selling so they could make more.

The No. 4 round-actions are really very nice guns for the money, whether they're called "Bournebrook" or not.

My guess is that there is some "incorrect" version in every country. Who in all honesty would use their proper name in a casual conversation? Just like BMW. Try dropping that correct name everytime you discuss one.

We had a top-of-line gun in the shop for years, an extra-long sidelock 20 with the best of everything that the folks in Spain had sent over as a consignment. Set it next to a Pudey or a Boss and it wasn't giving anything up to them. The price kept going down and down to the point where even cheap ole' me was considering it. AyA finally asked for it back.

Sometimes saying things correctly makes you look pretentious. I have one nice watch, a Baum & Mercier which is pronouned BOOM eh MerSEE. I have never heard anyone actually say it that way.

Hopefully they don't call them "BM's".

The mispronunciation that bugs me, concerning guns, is when I hear Leupold pronounced Lee-uh-pold. It's Loo-pold.

Cheddite is another common one. I pronounce it how it supposed to be and everyone looks at me like “WTF did you just say”?

Well, that was a nice dance.
JR

Manufrance sold 950,000 of one model. I doubt like hell AyA has sold more doubles than anyone else.

James: Probably to us they have.

At one time I was practically fluent in German (less so today) complements of my Uncle Sugar and 2 years living in Germany. I hear Americans with German surnames mispronounce their own names all the time. I don't correct them.

Bruce

Deja vu all over again.

https://doublegunshop.com/forums/ub...p;Board=1&main=31388&type=thread

Canvasback, in the last 50 years AyA most likely has sold the most. Numbers get tricky when you compare Eras to recent or current sales. In my lifetime AyA has sold a ton of guns. Spain was a go to source for price point guns for decades starting in the 1960’s if not earlier. Overtime several other makers have outproduced them for certain but the Spanish gun makers became major players which meant a decline in Belgian,French and British makers share. With the decline of Uk, Belgian, French and German gun makers we have seen an offsetting rise of Spanish, then Italian, Japanese and now Turkish production. I thought that China might also step in but their quality control was even worse than the Russians and consumers quickly went to other makers.

There is actually an interesting video about post WWII manufacturing shifts in Europe and how countries not bombed to scratch or bankrupted by war debt went into manufacturing like guns. Cheap labor, steel making ability, decent infrastructure and ability to undercut prices of traditional suppliers helped countries like Spain gain in the gun business. Also the ability to copy previous designs helped which is why Spain picked a tried and proven box lock and H&H side lock as their starting points. No research, no need to market new features or unproven designs. New gun at less than any used gun of the same design.

Beats a quiet walk to the gulag for sure.


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Darne. Is that French for shyte?

I recently found out the proper way to pronounce my shooting glasses. I have heard guys say everything from Di-Caught, De-caught so, who would have guessed that they are supposed to be pronounced DE-CO......rhyming with DEPOT (as in a train station)

That darn French stuff is nothing but trouble...

As far as sbs are concerned, I would say were and still are the largest both in volume and models for makers of SBS shotguns. They also will end up being the last maker.

John
Arrieta

Well, I bet if you are with a bunch of gun enthusiasts and you say, "AYA" (instead of A&A). 10 out of ten guys are going to know exactly what gun you are talking about. If you say A&A, about half of them are going to say, "Who's that?"

In the UK these guns are known by everyone and anyone as AYA. It is the used and accepted name and the guys at the long term importers ASI ( Anglo Spanish Importers) call the guns and all things related ( visits to AYA factory, AYA workers etc) nothing else other than AYA.
Very good guns in that bracket.
Regards

So "A and A" it is. Thanks guys.
JR

This is a thought provoking topic John. Unfortunately, the problem goes far beyond the gun community and the way some of them pronounce A y A.


A y A is a Spanish gunmaker that has been selling guns for decades, and I seriously don't think they are about to Americanize their name or corporate abbreviation just to benefit the functionally illiterate people here in the U.S.A. One headline in the news today is that Math and Reading scores among 13 year olds are at their lowest point in decades. This in spite of the fact that we spend more per pupil on Public Education than any nation on Earth. And the Liberal Left thinks we simply are not spending enough! Look right here... we have a Professor of Ecology who is mentally challenged by posting a picture on this forum, and whines about how difficult it is. We have a retired English Teacher who has repeatedly demonstrated that he can't spell or use punctuation at a junior high school level. No wonder Johnny can't read.

So really John, we have far bigger fish to fry. We have a large segment of our populace that continues to pronounce the word "ask" as "ax". Or is it "axe"? Don't axe me. If you want to keep a message secret from a young person, just write it in cursive. Schools don't teach cursive anymore because it is seen as too tedious. When is the last time you heard of Latin being taught in High School, even though much of the English language is derived from it? It is more important to teach children that there are more than two genders, and to have Transgender Groomers parading in in Drag and reading to young impressionable kids, in order to normalize perverted and sick behavior. We have a couple one day Holidays to honor our Military Veterans and our Soldiers killed defending our Nation, and a whole month to honor and celebrate abnormal sexual behavior.

Besides all that, English is quickly becoming a second language due to the massive influx of Illegal Aliens from Mexico and Central America. The 30 million or so illegals will probably have no problem pronouncing A y A correctly. Have you been to Lowe's or Home Depot or any Government Building lately? Half of the signs and notices are in Spanish. I keep wondering why actual U.S. legal citizens of foreign descent aren't filing Anti-Discrimination lawsuits, because their own Chinese, Vietnamese, French, Slavic, Nordic, and other languages are not given similar respect? We had a pro-2nd Amendment guy who was working very hard to fix this mess. Crooked Democrats just indicted him and hope to imprison him for the rest of his life, so they can continue to destroy the country. Here's another example of how they Build Back Better:

The Association of Yale Alumni" some of whom I would bet can pronounce Aguirre y Aranzabal.

and just to put it out there, it is a Hawken rifle, not Hawkens.

Most Yale and Harvard recent alumni these days are more likely to be allergic to all guns. They may be willing to give us proper pronunciation lessons anyways.

Keith: You want to talk about various languages, you need to come to Houston and let me take you around. At a McDonald's a young girl waited on me and I could not understand what she was saying. I had to ask for someone else to help me.

John
Arrieta

Now that’s disturbing.

Eating at McDonald’s.


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No quiet walk to the gulag for keith. No sir.

Spanish is spelled absolutely phonetically. However, both names are Aguirre y Aranzabal are Basque. So their correct pronunciation would be would be:

Aguirre = "A-ger-ray" (hard "g")
https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=APwXEdeLmnFI9YVzOBKEjRBtwMYznW2w3w:1687472954103&q=pronounce+basque+name+aguirre&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiY7fzP9tf_AhX7FVkFHY1TB6YQ0pQJegQICRAB&biw=1070&bih=599&dpr=2.61#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:d1fcd67f,vid:ey0pKAgAOVw

Aguirre = in Spanish it would be "A-gear-ray"


Aranzabal = "A-ran-tha-bal". Basque name "z" is pronounced as "th" - see pro golfer Olazábal

WOW! I wasn't even close! I always said Ageerah E Aranzibull

AyA doesn't bother me but I lose my $hit when people insist on calling their stock and forend (the wood parts) "furniture".

Correct, except that you did not give the "tha" the forceful accent it deserves. It is Aran-tha'-bal.

Ok then, so...how does Ugartechea sound in proper Spanish?

I have never heard anyone refer to either buttstock or forend wood on a gun as "furniture", but have known and used that term ever since I became interested in muzzleloaders.

The furniture on flintlocks, percussion guns, matchlocks, and wheellocks refers to the typically brass, iron, or pewter adornments such as patch boxes, escutcheons for barrel retaining wedges, and some purely decorative elements.

https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=31636.0

I don't want to get too hung up on trivial stuff like that, lest I start to sound like Dr. Wanker losing his shit over people calling action flats on a shotgun the "water table". On the other hand, I shake my head when I see someone showing firearms ignorance by referring to the frame of a double shotgun as the receiver. Bolt actions, pumps, and autoloaders all have receivers... but break open double shotguns don't.

BTW, thanks for the invitation to Houston John. But unfortunately, we don't have to travel to see evidence of the massive foreign invasion force occupying our nation, all thanks to Democrat politicians purposely preventing enforcement of our laws. Ever notice how just about all of these "poor" refugees has an $800 to $1100 I-phone and is somehoe able to

Addendum to my previous post which was submitted prematurely while attempting to correct a typing error on my phone:

...these "poor" refugees are somehow able to afford $800 to $1100 I-phones, and $8.00 per pack cigarettes, and also somehow pay for mobile phone service... all while hard working taxpayers here are footing the bill to feed them and put them up in expensive hotels. It's hard to believe so many of my fellow citizens lack the courage to even say that this intentional illegal invasion is wrong.

If you speak Latin American Spanish, ie seseo and not ceceo where C and Z are pronounced as TH, can you correctly say ArranZabal rather than AranTHabal. Gets a bit complicated, no wonder people just say AyA.

As I recall, it's Oo-gar-te-shay'-uh.

My minds spinning like a gyro…..or yeerrrow or sumpin.

Just call them oogies.

So, is it worchestershire, wistasher, or woostersher sauce? Or something completely different?

From the horse's mouth, the current owner of AyA pronounces the company name as A Y A. AyA Fine Guns . Very nice shotguns. I just had a quick look at their website and their prices have sky rocketed again. Appears a new AYA XXV/BL is now selling for 10,125 Euros. New AYA Boxlock Round Action selling for 11,129 Euros. New AYA No. 2 selling for 10,246 Euros.
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TC

you gar tek eeah

Sarahs kwet ah

El see smith

Never heard them referred to as anything other than AYA here in the UK !!!

Chief Amungum, most British people just say Wooster sauce, the final er sounding more lika A, like Woosta sauce.

Curious thread.

Lo cierto es que la marca es conocida aquí, en España, como AYA y no como Aguirre y Aranzabal. Se pronuncia AYA, como una palabra y no como tres letras.

Best regards!

You guys can pronounce your guns any way you want. But I'm going to pronounce my doubles- Winchester Model 21 !!

Long term inmates, help me out here.

I seem to remember a post put up back in the dark ages of double gun (you could post without using your name, so, it was pretty wild at the time) perhaps by Klunk, where he contrasted and compared a model 21 with a different US made double. I think it was a Stevens, but, an uncommon one, maybe a 335 (or, 385?) and ticked off all the reasons he believed the Stevens was superior. He had a Stevens with chopper lump barrels, anyway, but, it was a hilarious read mostly about his own feelings about the 21, which, he hated.

I’d love to read it again, at any rate.

Oh, and I don’t really care what anyone shoots. Or, how they pronounce the name of it.

Best,
Ted

And then there’s Versailles in France and Versailles (pronounced Ver-sales) in Kentucky. It’s a boring man who can pronounce a word only one way.

Thanks Shotgunlover, my greatG ma called it whista sauce. But then she was 1st gen American. Language erodes quickly!

Le Havre and Brett Favre.
JR

If I'm in the field or at a dealer's table (very unlikely now), and someone has an AyA that I would like to handle, I will approach him by saying "do you mind if I take a look at your A and A?" Everyone else to their own desires and devices.
JR