Ihad the luck to get a fine Dumoulin round action sidelock gun from Liège maker F. Dumoulin & Cie. What I find especially remarkable is the year of proof: 1943 ! That was in the midst of WW II, Belgium was occupied by the Germans and the production of fine guns probably was down. Nevertheless this gun is a nice example of Liège artisans. See more:
http://www.hunting-heritage.com/blog/index.php/2018/04/04/dumoulin-round-action-sidelock/Cheers,
Gunwolf
Very Nice looking gun, but what is your definition of a "Round Action". That is not what I would call a round action. It appears to be sculpted with rounding at the front, but all I have ever seen on a round action had the action bottom rounded all the way back to the wood.
@2-piper: well, it's not alone my definition, Holland & Holland seems to call it the same way:
https://www.hollandandholland.com/all-gu...hotgun_hng7112/https://www.hollandandholland.com/gun-room/round-action-sidelock-shotgun/maybe the Dumoulin is a little bit less rounded...
Cheers,
Gunwolf
Very similar engraving to a Doumoulin side by side 12 bore trap gun that I have. Oddly, mine too was made during the war around the same time; serial number 62444. A boxlock I have; similar period, 80135. Well made guns. Lagopus.....
Interesting, thanks! What steel are the barrels of yours?
Cheers,
Gunwolf
If you compare the H&H with your gun you will see it has a totally different shape to the action. The H&H has the bottom corners of the action rounded All the way back to the wood, this gun does not. There is no sculpting at the front of the bar on the H&H, it has essentially the same shape for the entire length of the action body. The H&H has a back action lock so the mainsprings do not lie in the frame bar. This Dumoulin from the pics appears to be a bar action. It would be I believe rather difficult to make a round action using a Bar action sidelock. Most round actions are either a trigger plate action or back action sidelock.
Understand I am not knocking your gun because it is not a round action, I have never owned a Round Action Double. I have several with a similar shaped action to this one though not of the same high quality. I just do not see it as being classified a Round Action.
I believe Steve Barnett has offered a Dumoulin once or twice with a rounded action. It looks much like Gunwolf's gun . Compared to "normal" Dumoulin sidelocks, this action has rounded edges . I would call it a rounded action. See Steve Barnett's "round" action Dumoulin.
https://stevebarnettfineguns.com/dumoili...on-sxs-12-gaugeAs to the date mark, I ,too, have found a couple of guns from the mid to late 40s proofed. Those trying times must have had special rules, but I don't know what they were.
Gunwolf, it doesn't say on the sidelock but the boxlock says Poldi Nickel Steel. The engraving on my sidelock looks as if it may have been done by the same person as yours as it is strikingly similar. Lagopus.....
Perhaps the picture is giving an optical illusion. I see the frame as it surrounds the bar portion of the lock as being a flat surface. Every thing behind thar forward sculpted section looks to have a perfectly Square (L) corner to me. "IF" I am not seeing the picture correctly do enlighten me. Look at this picture closely & then look at the one in the H&H link, I believe anyone can see the difference. Call it what you will, but I don't call a square, sharp corner Round.
@2-piper: I`m not offended with your opinion on the gun! It doesn`t matter, how one calls it. The corners of the action are rounded, not sharp. May be one cannot see it...
If you look here, they call it "Boss style round action":
http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-fo...un_id=100973747I think, it's nearly the same as with my gun.
Cheers,
Gunwolf
...and here is, how Westley Richards calls it:
https://www.theexplora.com/a-pair-of-westley-richards-20g-round-action-sidelock-game-guns/But of course maybe it's wrong.
Cheers,
Gunwolf
Maybe they made more guns during WWII than we think. I have a 12g. box lock, field grade with 80% case that is 678xx. I date it during the war. Great shooting gun on Pheasant and very light.
Daryl, I would say, it's very similar, but of course the engraving is a higher grade!
Cheers,
Gunwolf
Well, I think this article may clear it:
"The No 2 round body, which is available in 12- and 20-bore (as tested here), was introduced much more recently. It is, essentially, the No 2 that so many know and love with the sharp edges removed. Round-bar guns were (and are) most famously produced by Boss. A rounded bar is a means of streamlining an otherwise conventional sidelock or boxlock and sometimes removing a little weight.
To dispel potential confusion, it is not a round-action gun (as built around a trigger-plate mechanism and bow mainsprings)."
Read more at
http://www.thefield.co.uk/reviews/review/aya-no-2-round-body-shotgun-review#KCla4kokTlizX0Eh.99It's a round-body...!
Cheers,
gunwolf
Thank You Gunwolf;
The Field article very well sums it up. There is a definite difference between a "True" round action & these "Round Body" designs which break the sharp corners. The H&H shown appears to have far more rounding than the Westley Richards, which has more than the AYA #2.
I still see "Square Corners" on the Dumoulin frame, so it would not seem to qualify as even a Round Body. One could just as easily call a Browning Superposed a SxS. If you held it sideways it would become one, but that would not take away the sharp corners from the Dumoulin.
Again I am not knocking the gun, I just do not see it as a "Round Action". My
much less expensive & less ornate J P Clabrough back action sidelock has a action body with a very similar shape, though the rounded portion ahead of the sculpting may be a bit longer than this one. I find the Clabrough quite pleasing in appearance & I shoot it extremely well. It is however NOT a Round Action. The Clabrough even though a back action does have a lock plate shaped more like a bar action with projections running up the bar of the frame. They just don't do anything, apparently Clabrough just thought they looked better that way. This however in no way changes the fact they are back action locks, not Bar Action. I just believe in applying proper nomenclature to things, whatever they may be, shotguns or anything else.
That is a beautiful gun. Perhaps some would rather call it a rounded edge or blended action style. I think they did a nice job easing the corners over to give it pleasing lines. Wish it were in my gun room.
@lagopus: would be nice, to see a picture of yours..!? I just try to find out who may have made the engraving. Will let you know.
@2-piper: I understand your intention. I'm not so keen with the right nomenclatura, but indeed it's often difficult to find the right term in the diversity of gunmaking.
Cheers,
Gunwolf
A rose by any other name would smell as sweet. Nice piece.
Very nice gun. The proper and correct term for that type of action sculpting is “rounded bar”. Doesn’t matter what other manufacturers call it or designate that style, it’s a rounded bar action gun.
Well as I said I have guns with sculpted frames which are rounded in the front of the bar & then have square corners in the back. This includes, but not necessarily limited to, Lefever, the above mentioned J P Clabrough, Baker, & even a lowly American Gun Co (Crescent) hammer gun. None of these have ever to my knowledge been referred to as Round Action or even Round Body. This is what I am seeing in the Dumoulin, the front of the bar is rounded, but behind the sculpting it certainly appears in the pics that the corners are square.
The front portion of the bar on most of these I have are more rounded than this one appears but I would still not refer to than as round action guns. I do have a VL&D Knock-About made by J P Sauer & Sons which is also a back action sidelock. This gun also has plates which resemble a bar action & it does have the lower frame, behind the sculpting with a small radius on the corner. I didn't measure but no more than ¼" I would think. This would not qualify it as a Round Action, not certain even a round body, but it does serve to "Break" the sharp corners.
"IF" this gun indeed has radiused corners then please just say so & I will Shut my Mouth & Apologize. As is however In looking at the pictures it still appears that the lower action body has sharp square corners in the area below the bar portion of the lock plates all the way back to the wood.
"IF" the rounded portion of the bar ahead of the sculpting makes it a Round Action then I will just have to say that the vast majority of the doubles I own are all Round Action in spite of my saying I did not own a round action gun.
Gunwolf. Photograph sent to your personal e-mail. Lagopus.....