I recently bought a 1935 Fox Sterlingworth 12g that looks like it was not used very much. The wood and checkering is almost perfect and looks new. The serial numbers match. I figure if it was redone it would have cost a lot more than the $425 I paid. I want to take a look inside and lube it. I would take it to a smith to check it out and clean and lube it, but I dont want to wait 3 months to get it back. Could I take the bottom off if I have good screw drivers and am careful? Are there any other pitfalls? Should the hammers be cocked?
Thanks Dan

Dan-

There are a lot of pitfalls and if the shotgun is that nice, I wouldn't turn a screw on it if I were you. Find a good gunsmith, be patient and have him clean it for you. There are really no user friendly parts inside this shotgun and taking the bottom plate off will not allow you the level of access you need to give the gun a good clean, you will need to remove butt stock and action pins and a number of parts are under considerable spring tension. $425 was a steal and you are going to love this shotgun, I promise (I gladly paid $650 for a 1922 SW a few months ago and it is about a 60-70% gun), please post a photo, we never tire of seeing nice guns in original condition!

Doug

I agree completely with Doug-why risk messing up a wonderful gun?

Here are three doublegun specialist smiths in Penn. that you might contact:
Dewey Vicknair Ephrata, Pennsylvania
717-733-2145 DVicknair@dejazzd.com

Kenneth Myers New Oxford, Pennsylvania 717-624-8615

Rich Painter Economy, Penn. 724-266-0232

BUT-here are disassembly instructions I harvested from the Fox Collectors site http://foxcollectors.com/index.html (which you'll want to check out )

First you must remove the sears so that you can pull the stock off the frame.
Remove the triggerguard screws and trigger guard. The guard will screw out of the floor-plate. Next, remove the tang screws, both top and bottom. Remove the screw in the floor plate, lift the floor plate out of the frame by lifting with the triggers and tapping around it with a soft hammer, at this point, BE CAREFUL, there's a SMALL coil spring and the top lever trip pin in the hole that the floor plate screw came out of. The spring may fall out on it's own when the frame is inverted, (and probably will so BE CAREFUL!!!)) if not use a small wire to pull it out. The trip pin will stay in, unless the top lever is moved back to the center position.
I never remove the pin entirely. I simply push it far enough in to let the one sear drop, then I push the pin the other direction until the second sear falls out. I leave the pin in the gun. Don't forget to tighten the small set screw that keeps the pin from moving when you reassemble the gun.
You can now see the sear tails are against the wood when you pull the stock back. next, remove the tiny screw that retains the sear pin, using a small drift punch to drive out the sear pin. Tip the heel of the stock down to clear the safety mechanism and it should come off.
NOTE: There is a safety push rod in a small hole in the head of the stock that is easy to lose.
This will get the butt stock off and should be more than enough disassembly for a through cleaning and re-oiling.

Thanks Doug,
I will take your advice and take it to a gunsmith. I'll work on the picture. I need to look back and see how that is done. Dan

Dan-

It would be a shame to damage a shotgun as nice as you describe. The instructions posted above by revdocdrew are very good and I have done this myself following those instructions. I do not wish to by a hypocrite and suggest that you can't do something I did, I am sure you can do it. But my shotgun was not nearly as nice as yours and in spite of all the warnings; I did lose the trip spring (consequently my Fox is now powered by an old Zippo lighter flint spring). Also, others have actually lost the trip (a small metal part under the trip spring pressure) and I recall a few months ago another fellow got the plate off and could not get it back on and we all fretted with him over the frustrating attempts (I think he finally put it in a freezer) to get it back on.

Posting photos is really pretty easy. Take a digital photograph; better yet take several, I am eager to see your shotgun! Then create a photobucket account if you don't already have one. http://photobucket.com and upload the photographs from your camera’s media card. Once uploaded copy the photobucket links to your photos, you will want the links with the IMG code [IMG] your photo [IMG] and paste the link(s) into your message. Preview you message before posting to make sure you did it correctly, then submit your message.

Doug

Thanks guys,
Even though I am not taking the gun apart, It is nice to know how it is done. Sounds like one pitfall after another. Maybe someday I can find a SW to play with. The only double I ever took apart was an Iver Johnson back around 1968. It used to fire one of the barrels when you closed it up. It took me a long time to get it back together and that cured me until now. Guess I needed a booster shot. I will work on the picture tomorrow. Dan

Thanks guys,
Even though I am not taking the gun apart, It is nice to know how it is done. Sounds like one pitfall after another. Maybe someday I can find a SW to play with. The only double I ever took apart was an Iver Johnson back around 1968. It used to fire one of the barrels when you closed it up. It took me a long time to get it back together and that cured me until now. Guess I needed a booster shot. I will work on the picture tomorrow. Dan

I am the guy that is referred to above that had trouble getting the plate back on my Fox after I took it off.I have disassmbled countless other doubles without major problems but in the future I'll leave this one to a Fox expert. I would have been even more frustrated if it hadn't been for the patience and help from my fellow members here.
Jim

Enough to make me stay away from Sterlingworths. Laugh at my first year's production 20 gauge Model B (I know it aint a real Fox) but I can take it apart and put it together without a PHD in engineering or design. It handles pretty damned good too: light, slim, handy, and I paid 260 bucks. It now has a coin finished frame, good but plain walnut, reblacked rust blued tubes, and is the best a hardware store double can be except for maybe the much reviled Nitro Special which was king of the hardware store doubles. I guess I'm just a lower tier shotgun lover at heart. Maybe age does that to you. Anyway, I'm happy with my bevy of old cheapies but goodies. Chopperlump

Great deal on the Sterlingworth! Been looking for one just that vintage; if I could find one in that condition at that price I'd be smiling for months!!

Deekay, if you want to try it email me at gunscrew@yahoo.com.and i will walk you through it. A Fox is simple. Try an LC Smith if you want a tough one! Bobby

Deekay, as the feller who lost (misplaced the lever check/trip) I'd have to say that a warning about the pitfalls of home gunsmithing is in order particularly if you have a gun with some condition (unturned scews with good slots, tight wood and some color on the action bar). Also, it wouldn't do to suggest that the above is a "complete" Fox dissassemby but rather only the sequence of steps necessary to remove the stock.

In defense of myself and home gunsmithing generally, I'd had two Fox guns apart to this degree previously (another SW and a Fox BE which now has fresh rust blue,a new forend, and stock refinished and checkering refreshed) and lost no parts altho I did ponder the recalcitrance of both trigger plate bolts for some time before finally shocking them loose and backing them out. I punched the trip out intentionally but it wasn't in the pill bottles with the spring and other itty bits later. I bought a 12 ga. trip from an internet seller for 10$ and two hrs. after I opened the envelope I had it shortened and the strike filed to a shape and hgt. which would allow the rib extension to trigger the trip. There's a first time for everything (success and failure). One of the guys here who advised a bit on fitting the new trip claims to have lost an entire 20 ga. action bar. So stuff happens. It's risky to start on something like this without knowledge of a procedure such as that given by the Rev. Doc. Good lighting in the your work area, marked containers for parts removed, a work surface which is clean (white terry cloth towel works for me), wood-padded vise jaws are available to every one of us--not just to pros. Pin punches, small hammers, and Apex screwdriver bits which can be ground for a special application are also available with a little forethought and consideration before you start. All of it cheaper than professional help at the outset anyway. Realistically, I think the risk of loss of condition is the same whether it's a 500$ SW or a 60K$ Purdy but obviously the potential monetary loss is greater in some cases than in others. The very best step you can take to prepare for the possible hazards of home gunsmithing is to first ask yourself why you want to get inside? Strip and clean, badly damaged stock, or just the yen to tinker and explore? You'll experience aggravation sufficient to reinforce your humility in any case so the intended result should be worth the aggravation.

jack

Deekay, you could do worse than follow along to Bobby's advice. He knows a lot more than just how to get the stock off. And incidentally, there's yet another potential escapee from this procedure: the safety pushrod in a boring in the left stock cheek. It's easy to reproduce if you know the dimensions; not so easy if you don't see it and it gets away. Some guys like to remove it to achieve a manual safety. Loosing it is one way to accomplish this result but not the best. I see now Drew has that covered also.

jack

Jack, from now on when i take a Fox apart i will think of you! We need to change the instructions to place the action in padded vise up side down as the first step and remove the front trigger plate screw and then take tweezers and pull the little spring out and then the toplever trip! I have lost several springs and one trip myself! Bobby

Might as well. If you can't break the trigger plate bolt loose, twirling triggerguards and removing tang screws doesn't accomplish much anyway.

jack

Thanks for all the tips guys, I will save them. I would like to pick up a poor condition Fox sometime to practice on.

By the way, how would the fit and finish be on the screws on a Savage Fox. The screws on my gun are slightly buggered and the one at the rear of the trigger guard was proud on one side. I guessed that somone had the screws out, or tried to tighten them. The rear trigger guard screw could never have fit right if it was the original. From the factory, would all the screw slots be clean and parallel? Dan

DeeKay, a high-sided screw or bolt is by definition undertightened or overtightened relative to where the factory put it since they were filed flush to the surface surrounding the countersink (or counterbore in the case of the Fox trigger plate bolt). These surfaces are by and large not flat but have countours (lateral crowning of the upper tang)and the filed screw head only matches this contour in one position. Sometimes a full turn out looks pretty good but about 90 degrees out gives the game away--edges sharp to the touch, clothing snags. All a matter of degree. Take the cross pin out of a Superposed forend sometime if you want to see a real slant top bolt.

jack

A cut away Sterlingworth was recently up for auction. These views may help a bit. If any one can find an exploded view of a Sterlingworth....




Here is the exploded view of a Savage Fox
http://www.okiegunsmithshop.com/savage_fox.jpg

Pete

Trip hidden behind the hammer. Can't see the intertwining of woody bits and sear arms. Trigger plate bolt has a nice slot but they weren't left untimed like that even on a Utica gun, were they?

jack