Prices on guns can be weird things. For example, a pre-64 Winchester Mod 70 sells for about the same price as the Wholesale current production (made in Japan, I think). Worse is the Model 94 which IS Miroku at $919 Wholesale compared to a pre-64 which in really nice shape is about $700.

Then it gets even wilder. You can get an ORIGINAL trapdoor Springfield in beautiful shape for about $600 compared to an Italian copy for about $1500.

Getting back to shotguns. About any German 16/12 Ga double is hard to sell for over $600 at a show. This considering all pr-War guns are top quality. Equivalent non-German guns are over $2000. Some a lot more.

Yep Pete:
Once the mania went away regarding pre 64 Winchester Model 12s the high pricing went with it. I have a like new condition Model 12 in 12ga that was made in the early 50s and I'm have trouble getting $600 for it. I was told when I got it that the gun had been used exactly once for hunting and it certainly looks like it.
Jim

For decades, the Mod 12 was a $300 gun when the other pumps were $100 guns. I think the steel shot really hurt them. There was a resergence when they were allowed in the CAS Wild Bunch but that didn't last long because there are only 10,000 Wildbunch shooters. $400-450 is a more reasonable range now, and they are not quick sellers at that.

I've turned down $400 to $450 offers. For that price I'll just keep it.
Jim

Some like Featherweight, and 20ga will bring significantly more, but common 12ga 28" mod or 30" full in very good condition are $350 to $400 guns just like they were 30 years ago. Matter of fact about month ago $abela's had 12ga 30" full in very good original condition for $400. No vent rib, no 3" chamber no choke tubes is equal to no sale. The only exceptions are new police-style Mossbergs and 870s where you get 3" chamber long magazine tube, but usually fixed Cyl choke. Depressing isn't it?

I sold a like new early 50s model 12, 12ga, mod choke, with fat boy stock....450....

You did well. LGS had lightly used 50 12ga 28" Mod standard stock for $359.

Oh and BTW:
I sold a heavily used pre WW II Winchester model 12 in 12ga for $300 at a gun show last year. The one I have now is in light years away better condition.
Jim

If you don't need money now that isn't bad way to go. If you will need money in not to distant future now is the time to sell. It is hunting season prior to monumentally important election. Right now the media corp people are trying to make most $$$$ by having them glued to the screen saying it will be close whether it is or not. After the "dust settles" in not to distant future we will not be able to move firearm w/o FFL transfer. That will not be good time to move something like old Model 12.

And just how do you think Big Brother will know about a "transfer" of a gun that was never in the system in the first place? Private sales of "unknown" firearms have taken place forever, and will continue to.

SRH

I think it will be as simple as grandfathering. There are many places now that require a 100% registration for lawful transfer. There'll be indisputable proof that a person was not of legal age to have accepted an unregistered transfer, if someone shows up at a range or gets spot checked on a hunt off in the future. Some places require proof of registered ownership to buy ammo specific to only that gun.

Don't some states now require registration of any firearm in the estate of someone who passes on? There may not be the ability to just say it's gone through private transfer. Some of ole gramps unregistered stuff may get flushed out, but even if gramps legally did a private sale, won't registered stuff come up flagged if it turns up possessed by someone else? I think the strategy is to let the last folks who think they have rights just die off, and the next generation will just assume all is good with the new normal.

Just look at how well the multi billion gun registration system worked in Canada before they finally scrapped it. I firmly believe that even less responsible Americans would comply with such a system here and it would be doomed to failure.
Two States that now have "assault rifle" registration requirements NY and Conn. are seeing less then 10% compliance.
I can only think of the failure of "Prohibition" to come up with a parallel in non-compliance to a gun registration requirement.
I also firmly believe that we as responsible Americans are becoming more and more disgusted with a Federal government that's clearly out of control.
Jim

Who said anything about lawful? And, furthermore, it is not unlawful in most places to do a private sale between two individuals.

I cannot see anything you said that answers how "they" will know if I do not register a firearm that no one knows I have. This is exactly the reason that registration will not reduce crime substantially. Those who perpetuate crime with guns didn't buy those guns through a means that required a record of the transfer.

Who is going to know if guns are in an estate, unless the heirs tell the authorities? No one scrutinizes property that is inherited.

Buying ammo that is "specific only to that gun"? What does that mean? Where do you go to buy ammo for a one of a kind gun? Are you saying an ammo dealer will have a list of every person who owns a .308 W ?, for example?

I repeat, no one can ever do anything about guns they they do not know exists. Officer says, Joe Blow says he sold you a .458 SOCOM AR15, about 8 years ago. Answer, "He's lying." or "I resold it to a gypsy.", ad nauseoum. Who can know one way or the other? And, how about all the millions of them that no one will ever admit to even having in the first place so that they COULD resell? No way, craig.

SRH

A somewhat warped definition of a "socialist" is someone who keeps trying to do the same thing that doesn't work over and over expecting the next outcome to be different.
The universal registration system attempted in Canada didn't work and after the expenditure of billions of dollars it was finally scrapped. Does this stop a gun grabber like Clinton from proposing that a universal registration system be implemented here? HELL NO! We are getting way off topic here but there are apparently millions of clueless Americans who don't know this idea has been tried and failed and keep supporting a socialist dingbat who is proposing it here. And what does all of this have to do with the prices of guns? Well nothing of course!
I'm out of this thread since I fully expect the idiotic gun grabbing trolls who are still on here will start posting their typical inane comments next.
Jim

Working from memory I recall second edition of Shotgun Digest (ca.1980) had chapter on good value used guns. One of them was Winchester Model 12. I think price printed for nice sample was $400. I would keep that Model 12 only if you do not anticipate needing grocery or necessity money soon. Trust me it isn't going to get easier or more financially rewording to keep gun like that and trying to sell it at later date. To make matters worse Winchester no longer exists except for knives, cleaning kits, slings hecho en Chinie at Walmarts. In not too distant future it will be mentioned only in books.

Pump guns are as dead a they can be at gun shows. Unless black, cheap and ugly there is no interest in them. I guess they might have as much interest as cheap doubles but not much more if that. The only thing which brings less interest are bolt action shotguns. While I love them it is a true labor of love and a great time to buy them if interested. Plus there are thousands of them coming out of estates with zero interest form heirs.

Estate gun finds can be both interesting and a little scary. I herd of one which the deceased was a WWII vet who sent a few war trophies home. A couple of them were a real surprise. Along with the usual Nazi marked knives and flags were a well worn MP40 Maschinenpistole, also known as a "Schmeisser" were a pair of potato masher. It was unknown if the potatoes mashers were real or dummies but the "Schmeisser" was real enough and unregistered. Being unregistered legal transfer was impossible and there was no way to make it legal. The amnesty period to register WWII automatic bring backs ended one month after the 1968 gun control act was enacted.

Being a hornet nest I was told the items were destroyed quietly without bringing in a swat team, a bomb disposal squad, BATF to sweep the property for other finds for the next two weeks. If I had to make a guess the items were taken out to sea during the White Marlin Fishing Tournament and given a burial at sea. Sleeping with the fishes. But who knows that MP40 might have swam back shore and lives in someone else home to be found again in 50 years. Estates are full of surprises sometimes.

My observation, at local shooting facilities, is that the younger shooters (under 40) have little interest in Winchester Model 12's, Browning A5's, Ithaca 37's, and all SxS's. Many of us Fat Old White Guys (FOWG's) grew up adoring and coveting these guns -- which we couldn't afford at that time. Now we are dying off, or being domiciled in nursing homes, and our grandkids sell our old classics, or trade them in on something "more modern."

The younger shooters prefer camo 3-1/2" semi-autos and O/U's -- or no guns at all.

I expect the prices of 12's, A5's, 37's, etc. will continue to decline. They are passe'.

gold40

High prices are based on rarity and demand. With a generational turn over it becomes apparent how plentiful ordinary field guns are, thus falling prices.
Some guns are out of fashion, as stated above.Semi-autos rule for waterfowl, and pumps are less common than they used to be on the prairie.
Choice Browning Superposed still generate a lot of interest, particularly 20 gauge.
Not much surprising about lack of demand for common guns.

gold40 and Saskbooknut, I agree with your opinions. Doubles around here scarce as hen's teeth. Some gunshops won't take them on consignment. A new generation wants clickety-clacks and 16-inch cordite bags to keep them firing.

I didn't mention you or I or eight years ago. I don't know the answer to this, but what if this happens today.

A twenty year old is deer hunting or shooting a round of clays TODAY in Colorado. 'Officer' asks is that your gun, and the fellow says, yes sir. The officer then says, please explain, there's no record in our system that you ever applied for a background check to purchase that, whatever, deer rifle.

Again, I don't know what would happen, but the officer would know that the twenty year old was too young three years ago to own a rifle in that state when the law changed requiring background checks.

Today, if someone said, 'I sold it to a gypsy' a couple of years ago in Colorado, not eight years ago. What if the officer decides to ask, 'was a background check done'.

I understand and agree with what you're saying a hundred and ten percent. I still think, unless it's socked away forever, time alone will make it harder and harder to use the excuse that I got it from my grandpa craig. Sooner or later, the math will say that the future gun owner was too young to own a gun when gramps passed away, or the gypsy or neighbor or whoever.

Only thoughts Stan. I don't think the gal is going to make things any easier. Regardless of what King might say, her actual words, public and leaked private, say she's going at least the exec route to make things tougher.

I can't resist, Jim. A socialist presidential aspirant is arguably the most popular politician in America today. Universal registration won't work, at least for long guns, as the Canadian experiment proved.

When your fears are realized, you'll have to ask yourself why the GOP gave up on itself, allowed an unqualified to take it over to purge the party of racial minorities and and cast its lot with a declining white majority.

Don't blame it on "clueless Americans."

Just sold a 1957 Ithaca 37 for $425, shipped. It was a 16 gauge, 28" Mod, and was exactly how it left the factory-no choke thingy, no recoil pad, no weird bore machining, no rib, nothing. Used, but, not real hard.
Guy was happy to get it, and I had another guy who wanted it if he changed his mind. I think finding one, sans modifications of any sort, is getting to be a bit of a challenge. Oddly enough, I think the guy sought an unmodified gun, paid a premium for it, and then put a pad on it. I think it would have been worth less if it had a pad on it, and, I suppose, he made it worth less by doing that, but, he wanted it to be his gun after he got it.
So be it. It was a nice gun.
A rare gun has to be in demand for it to be worth money. Common guns (all pumps are pretty common) have to have a lot of demand to be worth any money. $425, shipped, is not a lot of money.

Best,
Ted

It seems to me that what we'll most likely get from Mrs. Clinton if she's elected will be more incrementalism on the gun rights issue. Perhaps a try at reinstating her husband's "assault weapons" ban and an effort to change existing law to eliminate the "gun-show loophole".

The '68 GCA left open the transfer of firearms between individuals residing in the same State as well as heirs of decedents living in the State of the decedent. That's what the left calls the "gun-show loophole".

Living near a State border my biggest concern when I try to sell a personal gun at a local gun-show is someone from the adjacent State trying to buy from me. When that happens I make the transfer through one of the FFLs exibiting at the show. The FFLs all have to do the background check on everyone anyway...Geo

Quite the contrary. "Clueless Americans" are at the very heart of the coming difficulties. The Right had several very capable persons for whom defeating HC would have been within the realm of possibilities. Instead, they chose to ignore political reality and gave the nod to a pontificating buffoon/political ignoramus who has guaranteed the the loss of the election. The "Clueless Americans" are clearly to blame and they are so clueless that they will think something was done to them when in fact they did themselves.

Stupid is as stupid does springs to mind

have another day
Dr.WtS

Wow, a whole realm, that's some meat-n-taters. Weren't the '08 and '12 candidates adequately possible? How about this go round. How could the high dollar, possibly capable, candidate have beaten hr-c, if his brother and sister in law are voting for hc?

Maybe, you should watch the mic.moore vid that came out yesterday, that, regardless of agenda, splains separating feelings from other things that spring to mind.

Thumbsucking Marxists should not be allowed to post on an American site.

I do not think the election will be close. Right know DJT is making his "egg nest" by telling them the election is rigged, media is against him....... He is a businessman and knows exactly what he is doing. Remember when Glenn Beck got dumped by Fox he took about 300,000 listeners with him and was able to make millions. This guy has millions of followers which is a "platinum mine". Astute businessman isn't going to make that kind of following go to waste.

Once again the Canadian sociopathic, religious statist chimes in and plays his typical "Turd in the Punchbowl" doctrinal game about the demonization of Republicans.

No, Comrade Sralin, it's about Freedom and Equality under the Constitution. Regardless of ethnicity. You can only create and pander to so many "victim cults" and reward them with other people's freedom before you destroy the economy. It's arguable that the establishment Republicans have gone along with this. This is obviously what's happening with Democrat policy, a goal I'd have to say is intentional. These are the reasons for the rise of Trump. It is the rise of Constitutionalism, with Trump being only the current vessel. Your ignorant bigotry regarding America is truly amazing.

Pete, it's an international site, from ocean to ocean to ocean, the hemispheres and overseas, valued by all participants for its information, opinions and entertainment.

The isolationist position of a presidential nominee will be repudiated in good time, as it will here. The world and Canada particularly believes the United States is great, if some Americans don't.

The GOP establishment have pulled Neville Chamberlain. They should have never allowed DJT to get nominated.

"Constitutionalism," in any form, will have little to do with Trump's humiliation next month, Ken. Demographics, as I said six months ago.

Perhaps you're right. Or not. We'll have to see. There's no doubting that your totalitarian religion is very powerful in America today. I tend to have more faith in America than do you, someone who despises the traditional founding principles of America, and who revels in the rot, decay, and corruptional aspects of America as it slides downward towards totalitarianism.

Jag, the term is "nest egg"...Geo

America won't go down, Ken. There's too much pride, the same as I feel as a Canadian. America has been great for a long time and will remain so for a long time in the future. The future won't be the same, never is. The verities that bind us to our countries are inexhaustible.

It will be a Faberge' egg nest, not an Eggsland Best egg nest.

_____________________________
Gotta go. Your jacket is about to hatch. Ron MacLean

Same old crap. The anti-gun trolls have turned this thread into a farce.
Jim

Your question is easily answered King. The GOP didn't give up on itself. The head of it, the elected senators and representatives, gave up on their base and became functionally indistinguishable on most issues from the Democratic rivals.

We no longer require TWO democrat national parties. The GOP can listen to its voters or move over...Geo

Jim, even though the thread started on the subject of gun values, the "anti gun trolls" haven't turned it into a "farce". Whatever they post simply needs to be logically and firmly repudiated. Then, anyone of any persuasion, who happens to come across this thread, can see the "anti gun trolls" as the fearful, misguided and controlling bothers that they are.

Keep a smile on your face Jim...Trump's winning!

CB:
I've had my fill of it. Someone else can "repudiate" these Libtard jerks as I have better things to do. I want nothing more to do with them.
Jim