doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com a shell question - Sellier Bellot

Ok, I thought I was pretty knowledgeable but I stumped myself.
I just came into about a box and a half of Sellier Bellot paper 12 gauge shells. I dont think that they are particularly old, maybe 30 years.
They are marked 70 on the side which I know equals 2 3/4" and have a picture of a clay target on the black & red tube.
The primers are marked SBP with 3 stars, I dont know if they are boxer or berdan.
The base is marked SBP 12 with a logo and "made in Czechoslovakia.
They are roll crimped and the top wad is marked SBP 3mm. The SBP is the company, but what does 3mm equal? Is it shot size? If so what is that in terms of American sizes? Or is it some kind of dram equivalent?

70, as you say, that's for 70mm long chambers, 2 3/4" The primers
are the same as US primers except they have a flange at the top.
German RWS use the same style of primer in shotshells.
The pellets are 3mm in diameter, same as US No 6 shot? I don'e have my calipers handy

I think 3mm shot is #5. 3mm would be 0.118" and subtract from 0.17 yields #5. I don't know if I've seen shotshells with Berdan primers; do they exist?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

The old all brass Fiochhi hulls had berdam primers,
The were made by the same company that made Alcan all brass
hulls taking the *57 primer

And the early CBC brass hulls took berdan primers, now marketed
as Magtech using large pistol primers

Mike

I have some berdan primed hulls from both Alcan and Fiocchi.
I bought a set of mostly new unfired unloaded paper hulls in gauges 4 through 410 a few years ago at the Chantilly show. The 24 28 and 32 gauge were Civlio Fiocchi Lecco with Berdan primers.The 4 8 and 410 were Gevlot. The 10 and the 20 were Alcan.
It was missing the 12 16 and 6.
I still need a 6 gauge to complete the set

I looked thru my stash of Alcan Italian primers, some being acquired and other kindly forwarded, and I don't see any Berdans. There are 2 flash holes, correct? What was/is the number of the Berdan Alcan's?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Boxer has the anvil as an integral part of the primer. There is a single flash hole as the anvil is underneath.
With Berdan there is a separate anvil as part of the case so you see two flash holes, one on either side of the anvil.
At least that is my understanding of the difference.

So the cases are Berdan/dual flash holes and without being broken into components one wouldn't be able to differentiate a Boxer or Berdan primer?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

a boxer primer has an anvil on the side not struck by the pin, a berdan primer just has the explosive compound inside the cup. The anvil is provided by the casing.

So, will a Berdan primer be efficient in a Boxer/single hole shotshell case?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse