doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com George Bate 10 bore, need help, Pics

Just took possession of a SL George Bate 10 bore SXS. Top rib has " Geo Bate 132 Steelhouse Lane Birmingham". My observations on other aspects of the gun are these....... 30" barrels, bores perfect. wt.is 9lbs/7oz. Nothing is loose, all fits tight. Chambers seem to be over 3 1/2", barrels are damascus with bluing overtop,using dial caliper,Rt choke .741" Lt choke .740" appear to be XFull/XFull. Serial number appearing on both barrels is 42696, on full length trigger guard tang 3291, on lower rib also,3291. Any thoughts on this mix of numbers. Watertable has only a pair of prooflike stamps, Barrel flat has lots of stampings, anyone able to sort these out. Any guess as to its DOM? What is the 3 1/4" stamp?, proof to 1 3/4oz.? Isn't the "not for ball" an old stamping? any help will be appreciated. Randy

Beautiful gun. I looked up some of the proof marks and a few of them are "since 1904". Someone else should be able to narrow it down more. Again, that is a lovely gun. Enjoy her!

Randy,I would say your gun was proved at least twice. the not for ball stamp was discontinued in 1887. If you have a 1977 Gun Digest there is an article on British proofs. You could sort it out with that. If you don't have a copy let me know and I can scan it and email it to you.

Jim

Randy, Jim is on the right track, your gun has the original set of black powder proof marks for a standard 10 bore, pre-1887, and a second set of London nitro proof marks circa 1925-55 re-proofed with 3 1/4" chambers and for 1 3/4 oz. of shot.This was the magnum 10 bore proof during that period.

Thanks....Does the "not for ball" mean the gun was made before 1887? Any thoughts as to why both barrels are stamped with SN 42696 and on the lower rib between the the barrel stamps is the Number 3291, also the same as stamped on the trigger guard tang? New set of barrels with the old top and bottom rib? No SN#'s on the forend iron or the watertable. Randy

The number on the barrels is most likely the barrel maker's number.

The numbers that do not match the guns serial number are most likely assembly numbers used by the actual company building the gun. These differ from the retailers serial number.
Steve

The third bite looks to be a W&C Scott "Lever Grip" ?

Randy,

As James and Terry have said it was made before 1887. The proof houses were using "Not for Ball" or "Non Pour Balle" on barrels with choke. As soon as the English dropped it the Belgians started using it, go figure.

As to your other questions, I leave to those more knowledgeable.

Pete

Note from the original proofing it is listed as 10B & 12M or the bore would accepr a 10ga plug (.775") but not a 9ga (.803"). The muzzle would acept a 12ga plug (.729") but not a #11 (.751"). Operating from memory, but as I recall the in-between sizes IE 12/1 etc were not introduced until 1887. If the bore is anywhere at all near the nominal then chokes of .740/.741 would fall well within the range of an ordinary full choke of the era.