doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Double Rifles, Paradox Guns & Gauge Rifles @ doublegunshop.com 577/500 Loads for Westley Richards

Howdy All:
Hope I have this in the right place. I just bought an antique (1882) Westley Richards in 577/500 number 2 BPE. I have dies and Bertram brass, and I am thinking about loading a 350 grain bullet over 98 grains by weight of Blackhorn 209. This fills the case to the base of the bullet. The rifling is Metford. I was hoping I might get some comments on loads and bullets and bullet lubes from some of the members here.

Texas Bill

Bill I used the info in Cartridges of the World for the basis of my reloads. I love that round. Good luck.

Bill, there are just three loadings for this calibre in Black Powder given in Bill Flemings superb book "British Sporting Rifle Cartridges". 1993. This was a private publication and is hard to get, all the copies that were printed have been sold and I have heard nothing of a reprint.

I'd be very wary about using any powder other than BP. The Holy Black was what this rifle round was designed for and the rifle built to withstand. The makers of Blackhorn 209 recommend the use of a small charge of BP over the primer to boost the reliable ignition of this powder.

Bye the bye, all lead bullets used in this rifle were paper patched and not grease groove, Metford rifling was also designed for use with paper patch bullets, so don't handicap yourself by using anything other than PP bullets.

Fleming lists three loads as follows :- In all instances 130 grains of BP are listed for the following bullet weights for 300, 340 and 380 grain lead paper patch bullets.

Do not use modern jacketed bullets of any type. Don't be put off using BP, Metford rifling is very easy to clean even using BP. Ivariably Curtis and Harveys No.6. Sporting Powder was used in F or FF granulation, (production ceased in 1976 and it is no longer made anywhere). Please use proper BP not an imitation, and use nothing finer in granulation than FF.

Fleming lists eight other loads with bullets weighing from 340 to 440 grains but with powder charges of Cordite, Axite or The Smokeless Powder Rifle Co's. Rifle Powder. All these were early nitro loads introduced after your rifle was made and there are no modern equivelents. The Black Powder barrels of the time were made of a soft steel and it was easily erroded and worn by high temperature powders and guilding metal bullets.

Enjoy using your rifle, but please use the correct powder and bullets.

Harry

Harry's post above is very well written, and is good advice as well!

I too have a Westley richards double rifle that is only a little younger than yours! Mine id chambered for 500/450#1 Express and also have Metford rifling, and uses 320 gr Paper patched lead bullets. My rifle is finely engraved, and is fitted with selective ejectors, and is hammerless box lock action. It was sold out of the London store in 1892 to an un-known buyer. This cartridge is hard to make because I have to make the cases out of hard to find 475#2 cases shortened, and formed, with the rim being thinned on the front side, and in diameter as well. This round and your's were considered deer rifles and most were used in England shooting red stagg and roe deer. or driven wild boar. Neither are considered usefull in Africa on anything that bites, scratches or stomps! Fun old rifle in the deer/hog woods! I don't shoot my WR much because
it is such a pain to load for! By the way Cartridges of the World is a fun book but has a lot of missinformation in it! I would be very carefull useing any load data from CTW!

I have a WR 1869 in 500/450No.1 express and have found the Bertram brass to be just fine in that gun.
Seems like working with 475No.2 brass would be time consuming and expensive.
I have used the thin copper jacket 350 grain Hawk in that gun and in a 500/450 No.2 chambered Farquharson and they both shoot great. Both have Henry rifling and not Metford though.