doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com source lever return spring Manufrance Ideal?

Got your drwg. sling disconnect from JCJ, Jeff. Thanks. No trouble with disassembly except the lock screws a bit buggered. Ed's Red (or any tranny fluid I suppose) is a good penetrant. Worked on mine very fast to break the friction lock on the bolt heads. The "slope" on the tang bolt heads combined with the deep counterbores is a bit much as you tend to throw the driver off-axis and they cant outbd. a bit and that may have influenced my effort also as I didn't know that until after I "stowed" the bolts back in the tang with the lock screw. Dien't cam out but raised a slight ridge on one of the tang screws. It'll burnish back into place or break off. I really didn't have any trouble getting the trigger plate out after I spotted the vestigial "tang" aft. The one shown in JC's parts list is a long tang for strait stock. It's really odd to see a long tang detached from a trigger guard. And those "screen-door closers" in the bar for the in-line strikers are different. That break lever does a lot of work (actually ALL the work). I think JC has a catalog illustration of the pin spanner tool that was meant to release the springs and the striker shafts, Serban. Also shows a driver bit with a slight convexity to the edge. I'm wondering if that's the one for the lock screws? They are so small and with the effects or previous removal sort of hard to tell.

jack

Hello Jeff,

Here are your diagrams which I have duly "safekept":


I believe the total width of 1 3/32 should be checked against the actual width of the slot on the stock just in case, to allow for good grip for extraction.
Le Lapin has them already.

I translated the disassembly instructions from the 1910 Manufrance catalogue;
This is the original to match the pictures:


Manufrance Idéal Shotgun
Disassembly and Care

The Idéal’s action is of such simplicity that she does not require, so to speak, neither cleaning nor internal lubrication. We recommend expressly not to put oil into the action, through the holes of the firing pins, the sides of the triggers or the under lever, etc. as if this is not a good oil, which is the case nine out of ten times, it will seize the action and prevent the parts of the mechanism moving to the point of sometimes not allowing the firing pins to operate.

The careful hunter will, on returning from the hunt, clean and oil the barrels on the outside and internally, doing it sparingly also to all external metallic parts. If this is done the Idéal will last several generations of hunters.

Lots of owners of Idéals being curious of its innards, we shall indicate the proper way to take it apart.

Each Idéal is delivered with its own kit that includes a hollow screwdriver handle A (figure to the left) that holds three tools B. C. D, used for the disassembly.
(Wish I could find an original one!)

1.- Remove the forend and barrels;
2.- (Fig. 1) With screwdriver C loosen the two screws on top of the action with great care, but -once loose- leave them in place;
3.- (Fig. 2) With the other side of screwdriver C, after removing the small retaining screw, loosen and remove the screw that holds the trigger guard to the action;
4.- (Fig. 3) Insert tool D so as to block the underlug in open position, allowing the under lever to remain depressed fully. Hold the trigger guard and remove cerefully as shown in fig. 3;
(To easily remove it, the screws on top of the action must be loose but in place).
5.- (Fig. 4) Remove tool D, remove the screws from the top of the action, and separate the action from the stock proceeding as indicated on the drawing.
For reassembly invert the procedure.

To all hunters that want to take their Idéal apart we strongly recommend not to force any part, as if there is any difficulty in the disassembly process it is because instructions have not been followed properly; in that case re-read them attentively and follow them exactly. Apart from this complete disassembly we can also, without removing the action from the stock, disassemble separately;
1.- The Loading Indicators.- For this use tool B, as shown in fig. 5;
2.- Firing pin springs.- Proceed as for the Indicators but using the other end of tool B, in other words insert the tool into the holes at the end of the action (fig. 6) and unscrew the long screw which is taken out together with the “rondelle”/(washer?) and the spring.- After cleaning the latter with light oil (pétrol is Diesel fuel) if necessary, re assemble in the same way.

Here, the original disassembly instructions can be enlarged.

JC

Wow, the +/- blowup is swell on the dissassembly illustration and combi tool, JC. Thanks for putting this up with your excellent translation of the dissassembly procedure. Neither my wife nor I could open the translation file so I just did it cold anyway. Only thing that worried me was the sears but as gun not cocked they came thru alright. I will get this archived damn skippy. I hope I can print out the illustration at magnification? When I reassemble, I'll look closely to see if takeapart steps are also good on puttogether. You are the poster boy for unselfish sharing, JC! I know it takes some patience and effort and unflagging enthusiasm to get the original "paper" and make it count for something practical and then give it away.

jack

JC is the Ideal man!

Jack, you can download the + page and then as you print it instruct the print program to "fill the page" with it.

Serban, I am still finding out stuff on them. Imagine I only learnt yesterday that the forend latch has three positions and that by putting it at six o'clock, i.e. pointing towards the action, you can take the barrels off and the forend stays on them. Lots of reading to do from those old Manufrance catalogues.


JC

Great Information.

If you mine the nuggets and then lose them in an electronic file drawer, Martin Godio's article in the Fall '06 will refresh your memory on these discoveries, particularly the 3-position "no lose it" forend latch. However, I'd save JC's dissassembly guide RIGHT NOW and a hard copy is desirable backup imo.

JL, Brownell tech says they have no measurements on the mainspring kit. Can you recall the major dimensions of the "S-39". The one I need to dupe is 3/16" wide, OA length bend to end of remaining arm: 1.25", thickness of either arm at the root of the bend about 3/32".

jack

I'm e-mailing you pictures of my S-30 springs. Dimensions are: legs, 1.20-21" long. Width, 2.70". Relaxed spread of legs, .690". Pin diameter, .125". Thickness at bend, .140". I had to shorten the leg(s) a little to make it work on my P Grade Parker. I have two of them left. I must have ordered three, at the time.

Jack, although not yet in my hands, the issue of the DGJ you mention, -with Martin Godio's article on Idéals- is actually Volume Seventeen Issue 4, Winter 2006. Pages 123 to 132.

Hope to read it during the weekend. I am blessed with a friend that has the complete DGJ collection and is willing to share it.

Best,

JC

JC. exellent translation!
You know I have found Ideal grade 9EE for sale in Moscow in one shop. Price seems high ($7,400) for this condition, but its matter of haggle with seller. I asked them to send me good photos.