doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com The Greener GP

The Greener GP ...isn't a high grade gun, doesn't have two barrels, and isn't much regarded by collectors. So I have no excuse for this post other than an unseemly public display of a private obsession, one of the few you can't be arrested for. So far.

The GP is the shotgun version of the Victorian Martini Henry military rifle, the British equivalent and contemporary of the rolling block Remington. Both were immensely strong and practical soldier proof weapons.

If you ever saw the movie "Zulu" it's the one used by the defenders of Rorkes Drift. At middling range it was absolutely devasting; firing a very heavy 45 cal soft lead bullet from a necked down (.577" ?) case, the wounds inflicted were descibed by observers as "horrific".

Already a long weapon, with a 24" bayonet it actually outreached the Zulu warriors stabbing assegai. The Zulus who had more courage than was good for them, were willing to take many casualties from rifle fire in the initial charge in the belief that they would be superior in close quarter battle. Colour Sergeant Bourne (Senior NCO at Rorkes drift) said in his memoirs that he didn't believe that any of his men (excepting the debilitated and defenceless in the hospital) were even so much as wounded by assegais.

The gun appeared in dozens of variations as per this site Jasons Page

Note the author's comment about the safety on the shotguns he shows....the big Jessie! It's a doddle.

The underlever falling block action was originally designed by Peabody, an American, and refined by Martini, a Swiss who rendered the mechanism hammmerless; Henry needs no introduction.

In it's shotgun reincarnation the Greener has three drawbacks. It doesn't like plastic cased ammunition, the stock shape is a shoulder buster, and the later versions produced by Webley and Scott post Greener's demise are poor...very roughly finished.

Get a nice Mk 1, fit a pad, use paper cases and you have a delightful gun. First class handling, great pointability, and just about the fastest single shot action of the lot...I'm up to twenty a minute aimed shots at clays (which is a long way from twenty hits) brilliant for flighted pigeon and duck.

There, I feel better now. Nurse, the curtains please!

Eug

Eug:
No need for excuses here, my friend!
Mine is a take-down, and in a previous life was hot caustic-blued by some kind soul, who obviously had no idea the action would turn purple!

Interesting restoration on yours, never seen one with case-colours before. Is that a re-stock, or liberal use of stain? The originals I have seen were invariably plain and some were blonde!

In Australia there are quite a few Martinis kicking around, I have a couple of Cadets, a nice .577/.450 Artillery Carbine, an Army & Navy .303 sporter (horn forend-tip, full-length rib, the lot!), and the GP.

Oh, almost forgot: ...and a 'sleeper' Westley Richards "improved" Martini Henry in .450 No.1 Carbine.

I'll take the bed next to yours!

Eug, Very nice! Next time you are out after the wood pigeon with it how about some pics? Twenty rounds per minute is impressive, imaginary flying Zulu drill, that? I would think one would be melting their finger prints shortly. Is that with a loader and a composed pair?

BTW, thank you for the quick history. Can one buy the .577 based .45 cal Zulu cartridge any longer? Might be a fun combination for Buf today with solids. Just an idle thot, a friend recently took delivery of a .505 Gibbs bolt action made by CZ. 120 grains of some kinda powder over a 500 grain solid. Not for me, thank you!

Once had a BSA Cadet barreled and chambered for .22K Hornet w/Fecker target scope, a friend has it today. Have seen the small actions made by Greener, Westly Richards, BSA & Francotte. I'm sure there were others. The few large actioned shotguns I've seen always looked like they would kick like a mule, but I have never shot one.

Marrakai

Supposition corner...if the action on yours is purple it is probably made by Webley and Scott. They didn't use a forging for the receiver as did Greeners, it was a casting and behaved differently with the bluing used. Purple ones are quite common.

Check out the Proof date codes, the price of a pint says it's a later model from after the late 60's.

A proper rust blue utilising a heavy chloride formula produces a permanent lustrous black. You can modify soldering solution to do the job (zinc chloride, ammonium chloride and hydrochloric acid)

The cased finish was standard and stood alongside the black; you paid your money and took your choice. I've owned both, and prefer the cased ones but they are hard to find in A.1. nick. I took delivery of a 34" one in beautiful aesthetic order, clean as a whistle, but the action was buggered up (right off the Webley production line) and couldn't be put to rights.

The one Dig got me was a purple 'un. The action wanted a bit of fiddling to get it right, but it's fine now. I have my eye on a minty Mk1, an real sleeper. The seller is a bit coy so I'll be applying the electrodes when he comes back from his hols. Assuming I get it, the Purple People Eater will be on it's way.

As to restocking that's my final move when I get the absolutely perfect gun (mechanically and aesthetically) I'm after. As Blackadder says "I have a cunning plan"; or rather two. The first is to fit what amounts to a Monte Carlo top piece to the existing woodwork. I feel i could do that myself; I've a bit of nice walnut from an old brummie hammer gun wreck. Second is to fit a Greener "Rational" stock; I need to reduce the factory standard drop but at the same time maintain the geometry of the underlever catch housing. A roach belly "Rational" would do that nicely.

tw There is a site where the reloading info is available; If I can find it I'll post it here.

The original bullet weight was (from memory) 410 grains, a right man stopper. The 24th Regt. opened aimed volley fire at 500 yards and the poor blacks went down like ninepins.

Lt. Chard's report (I have a facimile copy of his hand written original) states "...I noticed Private Dunbar (24th) make some splendid shooting, seven or eight Zulus falling on the ledge of rocks in the Oskarsberg to as many consecutive shots by him". Those rocks are about 250-300 yards from the mission and maybe 150 feet above it. Dunbar also shot dead the Zulu "induna" or military chief early on in the battle knocking him off a captured horse. I suspect that was a critical loss, they didn't seem to be up to their normal level of battle savvy after that. Their political leader Dabulamanzi, also on a horse took bloody good care not to be in the battle line after that.

Obsessed? Whom, moi?

Eug