I have a side by side francotte that is about as basic as one can get. I found the old post about a similar gun but the photos have been removed. My gun is marked "Francotte Arms" on the Barrel and has the AF under a crown proof mark on the water table. It does not have the Francotte Choke Bore on the water table. It is a recent European import. The Serial number puts it about 1936. The Gun is sweet and looks super. Just want to document it a little. It has the Belgium proof marks and Liege on the barrel. No model is listed.
Any help would be appreciated.

Victor23:

Post or email some pics which would also folks to see what you have. Proofmarks coupled with controller marks might narrow the date.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

ellenbr can I email them to you. I do not have a hosting site for photos yet?

yes, send them on to the email in my contact info/profile.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Victor, if you go to the Cabela's website, you'll find quite a few Francottes, with photos, in their Gun Library list (under European Shotguns).

Ok I got to the PhotoBucket website. Let me try to post them Now

17XXX is the serial number. Looking at the Francotte Low End range would put it about 1938 I think.

Francotte's Arms Co?
I've never seen that name before.
Small case 'r' should mean proofed in 1939.

What's on the top rib between "Francotte's Arms Co." & "Liege"?


Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

"A. BRUUN TRONDHEIM" Could this be exporter or original Owner?

I think that to be a firearms merchant in Norway: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trondheim .

Kind Regards,


Raimey
rse

Francotte on Simpsons

That's about as basic as you get. Were it an American import by Abercrombie & Fitch or VL&D, it would have been sold as a "Knockabout".

The gun was proofed in 1939. The controller of proof was Leon Chesnoy. Though that punch is easy to confuse for the Gamma punch that used in 1950.

http://damascus-barrels.com/Belgian_All_Proofmarks.html

I can't make out the barrel weight, but once proofed the weight was stamped on the barrels in kilograms. Also there is a "Acier ?" mark, which is "Steel ?", or the source of the tubes.

Pete

Larry -
To me, this gun looks more like a model I've occasionally run across known as the 'High Gun', most of which were made in the 50s or 60s.

I've never seen a 'High Gun' listed in a catalog, but they would appear to be a grade below the traditional 'Knockabout'.

Here is a pic of a ST 'Knockabout': http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/conten...anctble_02l.jpg

FWIW, which is absolutely nothing, from these pictures alone, I'm not 100% convinced Victor's gun was made by 'the' Auguste Francotte & Co.

A true expert, Bob Beach, can undoubtedly enlighten us...

If the Francotte trade mark is on the receiver, then indeed they made the gun. However, with the stamp only on the barrels it could be questionable. Francotte for a time, did source fitted tubes to other makers actions. Having said that, it is curious that the serial number coincides with the proof date stamp.

Pete

By 'on the receiver', I assume you mean on the side of the gun's receiver, like this one which reads "A. Francotte Maker & Patentee Liege Belgium"? http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/conten...n12_04l_bud.jpg

The crown over AF stamp has been known to be copied.

Lack of "Francotte Choke Bore" on H20 table is another issue, as Victor points out.

It does appear the gun was made in Belgium.

This has come up before. The name "Francotte Arms Co" was apparently a branch of A. Francotte and made entry level guns. Higher grades will not have the Francotte Arms name, but will bear some form of A. Francotte. They are genuine, made by the same parent company, thus the crown over AF proof mark, but simply made for a lower market and distinguished by a slightly different name.

It doesn't have the lovely & pretty standard Horseshoe pattern on the rib ,as all the August Francotte, maker & Patentee SidePlate Guns I have seen have had had.
The Francotte Arms Guns I have seen seem very inferior to the VL&D August francotte Guns from the 20's n 30's
just my take
Franc

Thanks for all your input on this. It has been a real education. I was thinking about hanging on to it. However, I was curious what a low grade Francotte might be worth?

A gun's value is determined by a combination of many factors, including maker, gauge, grade, bbl length, chamber length, trigger(s), wood quality, stock design, date of manufacture, overall condition, etc etc etc - but ultimately it's what someone else will actually pay for it.

There are many low grade authentic Francottes for sale on the internet - particularly 12 gauges.

Check out some of the shops @: http://www.doublegun.com/

A big issue w/ your gun, when compared to the vast majority of others, is that yours is marked as being made by 'Francotte's Arms' and does not have 'Francotte Choke Bore' on the bbls.

FWIW, a WAG on the value of yours: $425